EN-DE REPORTING SERVICES, LTD. 200 Old Country Road - Suite 620 Mineola, New York 11501 (212) 962-2915 APPEARANCES: SENATOR DEAN G. SKELOS Co-Chairperson, Task Force on Demographic Research and Reapportionment ASSEMBLYMEMBER WILLIAM L. PARMENT Co-Chairperson, Task Force on Demographic Research and Reapportionment SENATOR RICHARD A. DOLLINGER ASSEMBLYMEMBER CHRIS ORTLOFF MARK BONILLA, ESQ. ROMAN B. HEDGES DEBRA A. LEVINE Co-Executive Director LIST OF SPEAKERS Dr. Taj Rajkaumar Representing, Indo-Caribbean-American communities of Richmond Hill, Ozone Park, South Ozone Park, Woodhaven Ruben Pena President, Corona Business Corporation Marc A. Haken President, Board of Directors, Hilltop Village Co-op #4, Hollis, Queens Sachi G. Dastidar, Ph.D. Distinguished Professor, Politics, Economics and Society Department, SUNY at Old Westbury Inderjit Singh South Asian Community Council Al Jordan Public Affairs Administrator, Schools News Nationwide Kay Roberts Dunham James C. Lisa Executive Member, Northside Democratic Association Arturo Ignacio Sanchez Professor of Urban Planning, Graduate School of Architecture and Planning, Pratt Institute, Member, La Gran Alianza de Queens Sungkyu Yun Director, National Korean American Service & Education Consortium Genaro Herrera La Gran Alianza de Queens Virginia Pastorini President, La Gran Alianza de Queens Carlos Suarez President, Dominican American Society of Queens Morshed Alam Executive Director, American Bangladesh Friendship Association, Member Community School Board 29 Dan Tubridy Resident, Broad Channel Gary White Resident, Richmond Hill Suprabhat Sengupta Rene Lobo News Director, Producer, Host, International Channel Alejo Castillo Representing the Puerto Rican Legal Defense and Education Fund Leyland Roopnaraine Real Estate Broker, representing Richmond Hill Kawal Totaram Public Relations Officer, Queens Caribbean Bar Association Lucia Gomez Civic Participation Program Coordinator for the Puerto Rican Legal Defense and Education Fund Perry Reich, Esq, Resident, Queens Mohammed Sadiq Recording Secretary, Queens Village Civic Association, Member, Community Advisory Board, Queens Hospital Center Murray Berger Chairman, Kew Gardens Civic Association Yvonne Williamson Staff member, New York City Councilman James Sanders Glenn Magpantay Staff Attorney, Asian-American Legal Defense & Education Fund James Wu Asian-American Democratic Association of Queens, and Representing Ethel Chen, Democratic District Leader, and Julia Harrison, Democratic District Leader Aida Gonzalez-Jarrin Vice President, La Gran Alianza de Queens Lorinda Chen President, New York Chinese American Association, Inc. Frances Scanlon, Esq. Resident, Queens Norman Silverman All Rockaway Planning Council Lew M. Simon Democratic District Leader Norma Jimenez Community Planning Board No. 3, Chair, Youth Committee, Member, Neighborhood Advisory Committee, Spanish Program Coordinator, Our Lady of Fatima, Vice President, La Gran Alianza de Queens Ludy Herrera Member, Community Planning Board No. 3, Member, La Gran Alianza de Queens Leonard Cutler Bayswater Civic Association Richard Berger Member, Good Government Regular Democratic Club, Resident, Belle Harbor Bernice Cutler Resident, Rockaway Sara Berger Resident, Rockaway Rochelle Guinness Resident, Nesponsit, Rockaway Eva Farrell Resident, Rockaway Point Eric Strangeweiss Resident, Sheepshead Bay, Brooklyn Terry Harris President, Bay Towers Tenant's Association, Rockaway SENATOR SKELOS: We could start the meeting of the New York State Legislative Task Force on Demographic Research and Reapportionment. My name is State Senator Dean Skelos. I'm Co-chair of the Task Force. The purpose for today's meeting is to listen to you, hear what you think about the proposed lines, both Senate and Assembly. This is not a day where we just discuss Congress, because that's down the road, in terms of those lines. But, today, we want your input. As you know, the Task Force's responsibility is to come up with proposed lines that we will then have a meeting, formally vote on, and if the Task Force approves it, the recommendation will go to the entire Legislature. So, ours would be a recommendation. The Senate and the Assembly have to approve it, and then the Governor has the option to either sign or veto the legislation. Then, of course, in the voting rights counties, the Justice Department will review the final bill once it's passed on by the Governor. So, I welcome you to this hearing. I look forward to your input. We have a long, long list. So, I would ask if everybody would please keep their comments to five minutes or under. If you have testimony that you would like to submit, it has the same weight as oral testimony, and that would move things along. But, certainly, everybody has the right to be heard today, and we look forward to your testimony. I would like to introduce Assemblyman William Parment, who is my Co-chair. ASSEMBLYMEMBER PARMENT: Thank you, Senator, and welcome to this hearing on Legislative Redistricting proposed guidelines for the State Assembly, and the State Senate. I am happy to be here again in Queens. We were here earlier this year in a more open ended hearing on redistricting. We have now returned with a proposal as the Senator indicated. It was drafted and presented to the public and members of the legislative body about two weeks ago, three weeks ago, and we are now in the process of having public hearings, and we intend to use that public testimony to determine a plan that we can recommend to the full Legislature. So, again, welcome. It's nice to be in Queens again. SENATOR SKELOS: Thank you very much. A member of the Task Force, Senator Richard Dollinger. SENATOR DOLLINGER: Thank you very much, Dean. I'm Senator Richard Dollinger. I'm a Democrat from Rochester. I'm Minority Leader Martin Connor's appointee to this Task Force. Senator Skelos described our activity. We are here today to take public input on the proposed plans for the reapportionment and redistricting of the New York State Senate, and the reapportionment and redistricting of the New York State Assembly. We have previously been in Rochester and in Buffalo, and in your neighboring borough of Brooklyn. I think that the critical thing today, is we're here to listen. We're here to get reactions. We're here to ask questions and get clarification, and my hope is we will get an idea of the voices of Queens, and to what extent this group, and the people that live here believe that these plans are representative of the many voices of this borough. I look froward to it, and I thank you, Senator Skelos, for the opportunity. SENATOR SKELOS: Thank you, Senator Dollinger. Also, a member of the Task Force is Assemblyman Chris Ortloff. ASSEMBLYMEMBER ORTLOFF: Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I represent the Assembly Republicans. I'm appointed by Assemblyman John Strasso. It's really great to be back in this room and see so many of the same names who helped educate us last summer. I sincerely hope that you will give us the benefit of your comments, as to how well we reflected the concerns you expressed to us last summer. The plan that I am concerned with the most, of course, is the Assembly plan, which is the majority's presentation, drafted by Mr. Parment and his staff. I am hopeful that you will guide us and educate us as effectively as you did last summer, so that the legislation we actually adopt reflects your ability in each of your communities to elect the Assemblymember of your choice. SENATOR SKELOS: Thank you very much. Also a member of the Task Force, appointed by Senator Bruno, is Mark Bonilla. Mark. MR. BONILLA: Good afternoon, ladies and gentlemen. I'm the newest member of this Task Force, and if I may, I'd just like to give you a little brief on my background. I'm a practicing attorney just short of ten years. I practice in the five boroughs. I practice, basically, every area of law from criminal law to personal injury. My parents were both born and raised in Puerto Rico. I, myself, was born and raised here in Queens. I went to high school at Aviation High School here in Long Island City. I did my undergraduate studies at St. John's University. I have two brothers who still live here in Queens, one in Howard Beach, the other in Ozone Park. So, Queens is very near and dear to me. I just want to say that, one, I'm happy to be here, and more importantly, I want to commend the Senate Majority for appointing a minority to this Task Force. From what I understand, it was one of the concerns you folks had the last time. So, I want to commend them for doing that, and more importantly, for recognizing the need for diversity on this panel, and in society in general. Again, I want to thank the Committee for allowing me to be a part of this. SENATOR SKELOS: Thank you very much, Mark. Roman Hedges, also, a member of the Task Force. MR. HEDGES: It's good to be back here in Queens. I look forward to this afternoon and evening. We look forward to hearing from you and your ideas about what should be in the state legislative plan for Senate and Assembly districts. Again, thank you for coming. SENATOR SKELOS: Thank you very much, Roman. Our first witness is Glenn Magpantay, Staff Attorney, Asian-American Legal Defense & Education Fund. (No response.) SENATOR SKELOS: Next is Councilman Comrie. (No response.) SENATOR SKELOS: Phil Konigsberg. (No response.) SENATOR SKELOS: James Wu. (No response.) SENATOR SKELOS: Bernice Cutler. (No response.) SENATOR SKELOS: Dr. Taj Rajkaumar. (No response.) SENATOR SKELOS: You sit, stand, whatever you're most comfortable with. DR. RAJKAUMAR: Honorable members of the committee, I am extremely happy to be here today to present, again, on behalf of our community. The Indo- American community, and the Caribbean community in Richmond Hill, South Ozone Park, Ozone Park and Woodhaven. Last May, our community leaders requested this committee not to divide Richmond Hill into several Assembly Districts. We reported that our community did not have effective representation for more than ten years. Not ten days, not ten months, but more than ten years. Our residents have not benefited from basic socio-economic services that other citizens in our district are enjoying. Out of a budget of $5 million, guess how much was allocated for Richmond Hill? Not one penny, and I have the statistics to show you. Not one penny was allocated for the Richmond Hill area. This is wrong. This is injustice, this is disrespect, you know, and we much change this. Today, we are here to express our dissatisfaction and disappointment with the decision to continue dividing Richmond Hill, our community, our home, our family, into not two, not three, but four Assembly Districts. Why? We do not have -- again, we will not have representation for the next ten years. Are we going to reverse this trend, ladies and gentlemen? Are we going to put a stop to this? Will we count; do Indians count? Disbelief, shock, outrage, frustration, are only some mild sentiments expressed by our South Asian and Indo-Caribbean community in Richmond Hill. I have a tape. I am the host of a weekly TV educational program here in Queens on cable TV, Channel 62 and 76. We roll the camera in our community. I prepared a tape, but I was told today, you know, that we do not have a VCR to show the tape, but I have it with me for your record, if you'd like to have a copy of it. But, within the next couple of months, it is anticipated that several Indo-American radio and television programs will be holding public discussions to deal with this issue if this situation is not reversed. I am inviting all members of this committee to participate in this discussion with me on my program. I'm not going to be sentimental or emotional here today, because I think you have the point that I'm making. What I have with me here is a proposal. Can we reverse this situation, this injustice that has been inflicted on our Asian people? Yes, we can. The people who are involved in my proposal are Assemblywoman Vivian Cook, who has 74,000 Black residents in her Assembly District 32. Assemblywoman Audrey Pheffer, who has approximately, 24,000 White residents in her district, her Assembly District 23, and Assemblyman Anthony Seminaro, who has about 15,000 South Asians in his district. Here is my proposal. The Assembly Districts 31 is currently vacant; right? Assembly District 31 is comprised of Springfield Gardens, Rosedale, Far Rockaway, South Ozone Park, and Richmond Hill. Now, let's take Assemblywoman Audrey Pheffer. Assemblywoman Audrey Pheffer, she has a part of Richmond Hill. My proposal is that, let her return this portion of Richmond Hill to us, and we'll give her Far Rockaway, which is part of the 31st Assembly District. For Vivian Cook, let her take Springfield Gardens and Rosedale. Give us back Richmond Hill, and part of South Ozone Park. Assemblyman Anthony Seminaro, give us back part of South Ozone Park -- I mean, Ozone Park and Richmond Hill, and we will have a piece of the Assembly District 32, Vivian Cook's area, because when we look at the figure, 123,855, which is the population of an Assembly District, she will have more than that number of residents in her district. So, we can look at the map and make sure all three of them will stay within the 123,855 people. All we're doing here, we're asking the three distinguished Assembly members to work with us and make this happen. By exchanging, by giving us these areas, and we giving them back part of our area, guess what, everybody wins. Audrey Pheffer is going to still have her majority White votes, and she will stay in office. Vivian Cook, she will still have her majority Black votes, and she will stay in office. Anthony Seminaro will still have his majority vote, and be in office, and our Indians, our South Asians and Indo- Caribbean people will have an Assembly seat, we will have a representative that will be taking care of our needs, like they have been taking care of their needs for their people for the past ten years. Finally, I would like to leave with this committee a statement that means a lot to all of us. This statement reads as follows. The outcome of this exercise must not give any citizen of our world a reason to question the integrity of our democracy in America. Thank you, ladies and gentlemen. (Applause.) SENATOR SKELOS: Thank you. Any questions? (No response.) SENATOR SKELOS: Ruben Pena. MR. PENA: Good afternoon, ladies and gentlemen of the committee. SENATOR SKELOS: You have to talk into the microphone. You can sit or stand, whatever is most convenient for you. MR. PENA: Okay. Good afternoon, ladies and gentlemen of the committee. My name is Ruben Pena. I am here to represent the community of Corona. I am the President of the Corona Business Corporation, a substitute member of the Hispanic Chamber of Commerce, and Vice President of La Gran Alianza de Queens, an organization from Corona, Queens. I have been conducting business in the Corona area for 28 years, and it is sad to see how little this community has advanced in this length of time. I have been working with Community Board 3, Community Board 4, Police Precincts 110 and 115, New York City Parks Department, Sanitation Department, and with the elected officials of the area, and with this assistance, we have accomplished some projects, but there is still lots to do. In many community meetings, I have brought to the table the needs of the area, and I have a copy of the list of these necessities that I personally handed to elected officials in the very first meeting conducted by Corona Business Corporation in October 1998. So far, the only thing that is accomplished from this list is an allocation of $1.5 million for the expansion of the Corona Branch Library and, hopefully, this work will start in the spring 2002. I am here today together with several community leaders to represent over 200 merchants to submit and request from you the study and consideration of a design of the new District 39 that best fits the needs of this particular community. The proposed new District 39 lines designed by the New York State Task Force is not acceptable, as it does not suit this extremely diversified community. The New York State Task Force is a group of people doing their job, but in reality they don't have a clue of what are the real needs of this community. None of them live or conduct business in this area. They are not raising a family in the neighborhood. They have no need for a decent library. They do not have to stand waiting on line in an overcrowded Post Office for 25 or 30 minutes for service. They have no need for a day care center. In other words, the lack of these services in the community does not impact them directly. These researchers follow statistics and numbers, and those look very attractive on paper, but in reality, they do not fit or solve the needs of this particular community. As you may clearly see, in the four years since we discussed and presented our needs to the elected officials, our requests have not been taken care of. P.S. 19 is more crowded than before, and children have to attend classes in portable classrooms. The request of two traffic lights, one on 41st Avenue and National Street, and another one on 99th Street and 41st Avenue have not been installed. The crossing guard to National Street and 41st Avenue has not been moved. There have been many verbal requests for a new Post Office. The size of the facility and amount of clerks in the existing Post Office is far from accommodating the needs of this overcrowded community. The Library has not started its renovation project. In the new proposed District we need a fair, honest, caring, involved and responsible leader, to whom we can address our necessities and obtain results for the improvement of our neighborhood. We want to exercise our right to choose who and what is in the best interest of the community. Corona has been neglected, and we have been in the shadow for too long, and we are prepared to step out and fight for whatever is needed. It is the hope of the Corona community that this plea for the rightful planning of District 39, according to our desire and necessities is taken into serious consideration and does not get stored in another file cabinet, because we deserve attention to our concerns and needs. Submitted for your consideration, respectfully, by Ruben Pena. Thank you very much for whatever you can do about the new District 39. We need it. We have been forgotten for many, many years, and it's a community that really is crying for help. Thank you. MR. BONILLA: Sir, I just want to tell you -- I don't know if you heard my opening statement. I'm originally from Queens. I grew up here. I have family members in Queens. So, I understand what you're saying, and not that I dispute what you say, but I want you to be aware that my family members are out there with you on those lines and certainly, maybe, that wasn't true before, but it's true now. So, I understand your concerns, and I appreciate them. MR. PENA: Thank you. ASSEMBLYMEMBER PARMENT: One question. Sir, I wasn't sure, are you in favor of the creation of the proposed 39th Assembly seat as put forth in this plan, or would you be opposed to that? MR. PENA: I am opposed to the design made by the task force. ASSEMBLYMEMBER PARMENT: Okay. MR. PENA: We designed, with the community leaders and church people, a new district, which is parallel to the community. You know, this community is very diversified, and we have a lot of needs. We tried to include all these people in this new district, which we appreciate that you take into consideration and approve the one we have designed for this new district. Does that answer your question? ASSEMBLYMEMBER PARMENT: Thank you. SENATOR SKELOS: Thank you. Marc Haken. ASSEMBLYMEMBER PARMENT: You skipped one. SENATOR SKELOS: I'm sorry, Ruben Quiroz. Is Ruben here? (No response.) SENATOR SKELOS: Your next, Marc. MR. HAKEN: Good afternoon, Mr. Chairman, members of the Reapportionment Committee. My name is Marc Haken, and I'm President of the Board of Directors of Hilltop Village Co-op # 4 in Hollis, Queens. I speak for the 300 families of Hilltop 4, on legislative reapportionment of our area of Queens. When I was a child, my father told me, if it ain't broke, don't fix it. I have used this axiom as one of the guidelines of my life. We of Hilltop wish to retain Mark Weprin as our State Assemblyman and frank Padavan as our State Senator. Both of these legislators have served us well. Mark's parents, Saul and Sylvia, lived at Hilltop, and as Mark so often says, he was created there. He has never lost his personal attachment to us. His top notch office staff, Ruth Louise Wimpfheimer and Arlene Ann Bealon, have solved hundreds of problems presented by our shareholders, ranging from Medicare and other senior citizens' issues to matters dealing with immigration, veterans affairs, youth affairs and housing. Also, as President of Friends of Cunningham Park, I must thank Mark for assisting us in securing a $3,000 matching grant, to secure State Landmark Status for the Long Island Motor Parkway. We affectionately call it the Vanderbilt Motor Parkway. Frank, without a doubt, has the second best constituent office in the state. His office has helped scores of our shareholders to secure benefits due to them, and he has obtained funding for many of our institutions. Also, we are to have a Congressional redistricting. We have been ably represented by Congresswoman Nita Lowey since the redistricting of 1992, and we would like to retain her. However, if we are to get a new Congress person, we want Gary Ackerman. Gary was our Congressman prior to 1992, and is most familiar with our complex and its residents. We know that the prime purpose of our Legislature is to provide us, the citizens of New York, with the best services possible; is that not so? We feel that we will be best served by Mark Weprin in the Assembly, Frank Padavan in the State Senate, and Gary Ackerman in the U.S. Congress. Thank you so much. SENATOR SKELOS: Thank you. Any questions? MR. HAKEN: I'm prepared to answer any and all. SENATOR SKELOS: Sachi Dastidar. DR. DASTIDAR: I am writing this as a resident of New York . Nevertheless, I am using my experience as the first person of Indian origin to be elected to the New York City School Board. I was elected to District 26, August 28, where I served two years as the Secretary, and the following third year as the Vice President. I did not run for reelection. I serve as the Chair of Trustees of the Probini Foundation, which promotes education for the needy of the Indian Subcontinent, and attempts to bridge the native-born and immigrant communities of New York through other social projects. I was a former Co- Convener of South Asia Forum and serve on the Executive Committee of two Democratic clubs. I, also, serve on organizations of Indo-American, Bangladeshi-American and non-ethnic communities. I teach public policy, and state and local governments at SUNY at Old Westbury. I live in Bellerose. Both my son and daughter graduated from New York City public schools. I have studied the proposed district boundaries of both the New York State Assembly and New York Senate seats covering the eastern end of Queens, especially covering the Bellerose, Floral Park, Queens Village, Little Neck, Glen Oaks, and Fresh Meadows neighborhoods, with great interest. As you are well aware of the fact that in these areas there is a growing presence of Asians, especially Asian-Americans of Indian and South Asian origin. Social, cultural and religious institutions of the Indians and other South Asians are increasingly migrating into these neighborhoods, responding to the growing needs of the community, enriching the lives of all New Yorkers. Our Hindu-Jain mandirs, Muslim mosques, Indian Christian Churches, Sikh gurdwaras, Buddhist viharas, music, dance and yoga schools, meditation centers, language pathshals, groceries and restaurants are relocating in large numbers. These institutions and other commercial ventures are energizing storefronts and buildings which otherwise may have fallen into decay. Preliminary proposals for both the Assembly and Senate districts split these communities into two diverse districts. I would urge the Task Force to keep these communities together for both the Assembly and Senate districts. Splitting our communities into separate constituencies may affect our institutions. This, I would request you not to support. Please keep the communities and their institutions together. Back in the Subcontinent, our parents suffered what historians call, British divide and rule policy. Let us avoid that. In the 1990 census, Asians comprised barely about 5% of the population of the area. Ten years later in some areas, Asians are over 50% of the population, and in one proposed Assembly district they are 28% of the population. This after the division of the community into two proposed Assembly districts, and this trend in demographic change is expected to continue. Asians live side-by-side with Whites, Blacks, Hispanics, Christians, Jews and Hindus. No doubt, any interest could be represent by an open-minded elected official of any background. This is certainly true. But, if I accept this logic, then this defies the logic of gerrymandering, which then must be discontinued. I will end my testimony by saying a few words from my experience after I got elected to the School Board. I was pleased to get calls from lots of immigrant parents, especially from the Subcontinent, asking questions about their schools and their school system. Calls came from my district and beyond. This surprised me. Calls and queries, also, came from native-born school officials and faculty. I was invited to speak at several districts with Asian populations. There was no malice or prejudice in any of these calls. As it happened, in one particular school district, many of us had been invited to come to present, to speak for the district that we represented. What dawned on me is this. Although there are hundreds of good and caring people in their local school districts, some of these parents and staff were comfortable talking to another person who looked like other Asians, especially as another person from India and the Indian Subcontinent. This was their choice. I would request you to keep the Bellerose, Floral Park, Queens Village, Little Neck, Glen Oaks, and Fresh Meadows neighborhoods together in one district. Thank you for listening. SENATOR SKELOS: Thank you very much, sir. Aida Gonzalez-Jarrin, J-a-r-r-i-n. (No response.) SENATOR SKELOS: Sheldon Lefler. (No response.) SENATOR SKELOS: Lorinda Chen. (No response.) SENATOR SKELOS: Inderjit Singh. MR. SINGH: Good afternoon. I thank you for giving me this opportunity to come and talk to you about the proposed apportionment in the Assembly and the Senate. You have been given enough statistical information to justify the growth, in the last decade, of the various communities in Queens, as well as the rest of the City of New York. I won't belabor that point. I want to ask you to share with me some principles, that I think are intrinsic to the democracy and good government in this country. One of those is that the government of the City and the State of New York should reflect the people who live in this city and this state. The representatives which take the message from the voters to the elected Assembly and the Senate in New York should represent the people who live in their district. Unfortunately, some of the districts that are being assigned do not do that. Dr. Rajkaumar initially the first presenter, told you about what was happening in Richmond Hill, which is a community of mostly South Asians or people of South Asian origin, along with some of the other residents who have been there before us. But, by dividing that community into four or five Assembly districts, you are effectively disenfranchising the people who live in that district. I think it's wrong. I think it's unfair and, therefore, I want to appeal to your conscience. Please, make sure that the government in the City, and the State of New York is representative, it's the kind of government that we can take pride in, and it's the kind of government that represents the people that it says it does. I won't belabor the point. I thank you very much. SENATOR SKELOS: Thank you for being here. Are there any questions? SENATOR DOLLINGER: Yes. Could you just identify for me, you used the phrase South Asian. Could you tell me what countries or ethnic groups that includes, as you describe that term? MR. SINGH: India, Pakistan, Bangladesh, Salan and people contiguous to those countries, could be Afghanistanis, could be people from Napal, Malayasia. South Asia would be a generic for most of those people, excluding the Chinese and the Japanese. SENATOR DOLLINGER: Okay, and you would, also, exclude Southeast Asians from there? MR. SINGH: No, I would include them. South Asia would include southeastern, as well as southwestern countries. SENATOR DOLLINGER: Thank you. SENATOR SKELOS: Any other questions? (No response.) SENATOR SKELOS: Thank you, sir. MR. SINGH: Thank you. SENATOR SKELOS: Frances Scanlon; is Frances here? (No response.) SENATOR SKELOS: Tarry Hum. (No response.) SENATOR SKELOS: Norman Silverman. (No response.) SENATOR SKELOS: Is Norman here? (No response.) SENATOR SKELOS: Lew Simon. (No response.) SENATOR SKELOS: Is Lew here? (No response.) SENATOR SKELOS: Norma Jimenez. (No response.) SENATOR SKELOS: Is Norma here? (No response.) SENATOR SKELOS: Carmen Aponte. (No response.) SENATOR SKELOS: Al Jordan. (No response.) SENATOR SKELOS: Kay Roberts Dunham. VOICE: Al Jordan is here. SENATOR SKELOS: I'm sorry, your name? MR. JORDAN: Al Jordan. SENATOR SKELOS: Come on up. MR. JORDAN: I live just on the other side of the Courthouse there in Briarwood, and I have strong relations or ties with the community. As far as St. Albans, I have a family heritage there. I have friends in Far Rockaway and South Ozone Park. I work for School News Nationwide located in Brooklyn, New York, but we are a community outreach. What I do there, I'm a Public Affairs Administrator, and we've had programs set up here in the various schools in Queens. I, also, serve as a freelance journalist for them, as well, which brings me to -- I know we're pressed for time -- my reason for being here. I have a calendar here from the United States Representative, a good friend of mine, Congressman Owens, over in Brooklyn, and today is a landmark day, as a lot of days are in our government. Today, it says here for the 13th, that Washington Federalists published a letter that voiced support for federal administration of the judicial system. When I think about why we're here, and the reapportionment, I think about the word reform. If I may, I'd just like to read a brief article from one of my colleagues over at Long Island University. It should take about maybe, two minutes of your time, if I may. It says -- the topic is: Eyes on Us. Nation Looks to Brooklyn for Court Reform. This may be on a lower scale, but whatever is on the bottom is usually holding us up, and it says: The Brooklyn Court system has, at times, been a trailblazer for the rest of the state and even the nation. Brooklyn had the first drug treatment Court, the first true domestic violence courts, and the first and only mobile jurisdictional court in the country. Now, facing the barrage of scandal surrounding ethics abuses and other improprieties allegedly committed by its judges, not the least of which are soliciting and bribes, the Brooklyn Courts are being eyed by judicial reformers, who seek to depoliticize the system and make it one of the few in the nation that is free from the appearance of political patronage. All Court reform advocates and groups are watching Brooklyn carefully, said Steven Zinman (phonetic), Executive Director of the Fund for Modern Courts. The fact of the matter is, a great proportion of the number of judges whose conduct has come under criticism, either by prosecutors or the Judicial Conduct Commission have come from Kings County, said Carver, a board member of the Fund for Modern Courts. Carver, who served as Corporation Counsel under former Mayor David Dinkins, is the former Chairman of the State's Commission on Judicial Conduct. They have been the focus, and it is unfortunate, because there are so many outstanding judges for Kings County, Carver has said. The Brooklyn judiciary has come under heavy scrutiny in recent months with charges ranging from nepotism to bribery. Several judges have been transferred, and Brooklyn's Chief Administrative Judge, Justice Michael Peace (phonetic), was moved to the Appellate Term to make way for the state's third highest judge, Justice Ann Pufu (phonetic), to assume the role of keeping a watchful eye on the Brooklyn Courts. The actions of the Office of Court Administration sends a big message when you send a Deputy Chief Administrative Judge into a particular county. You may ask why I'm reading this. I don't want to take up too much more of your time, but the gist of it is just about as strong, and if I could ask a question, I worship with Senator Malcolm Smith on Sundays over at Allen A.M.E., and I'd like to know what's going on along Sutphin Boulevard, how come there's always so much construction going on over there. As far as if I'm for or against the proposal, I have to look further into that. But, just about reform, we can learn from anybody, and what's going on over there is change. I think that's what we're here about today is change. A lot of times, we're afraid of change, and change is good. Some change is good, and I think we need change. I would just like to thank you for this time to read this article. SENATOR SKELOS: Thank you very much. Kay Roberts Dunham. MS. DUNHAM: Good evening to the Co- Chairmen, and the panel, and good evening all. I'm Kay Roberts Dunham, and after picking -- going to demographics today, now I'll be able to find my way around Queens. I counted 18 Assembly Districts, and five Senatorial Districts, and before I go any further, I would like to salute some of our Senators. Ada Smith, the 12th; Malcolm A. Smith, in the 10th Senatorial District, Toby Stavisky (phonetic), 16th; Mary Santiago; Alan Hevesi, that's in the 13th Senatorial District. I would -- there are so many more in the Assembly. I would really not like have to have to lose any of our legislators. So, I'll be in all boroughs to try to do my part, that we will not lose our legislators for the new district lines. It's my opinion that the Senate Majority plan is discriminatory and illegal, because it overpopulates all of the districts in New York City, thereby diluting the voting power of all residents of the entire region. It increases the size of the Senate from 61 to 62, thereby reducing the proportion of Senate districts in which minority group voters can elect representatives of their choice, and diluting the voting power of minority group voters statewide. New York City's population grew by 9.4 during the 1990s, much faster than the state as a whole. Since the Census Bureau acknowledges that minority groups were under counted, overpopulating the downstate districts will only magnify the effect of the under count. In other words, the proposed downstate districts are even more overpopulated, and the dilution of minority voting power is even worse than the Census counts indicate. We don't want you to rip our neighborhoods apart. We don't want gerrymandering at its worst to elect the legislators. What is happening is, it's this legislator against that legislator and maybe wiping out an area where we will lose a valuable Senator or valuable Assemblyman. We feel that -- it is my opinion that the election will be done by the ballot and not by gerrymandering, and not by manipulating the districts. I think that's all I have to say. SENATOR SKELOS: Thank you. Are there any questions? (No response.) SENATOR SKELOS: Thank you very much. Earl Williams. (No response.) SENATOR SKELOS: James Lisa. MR. LISA: Good afternoon. My name is James Lisa. I'm an Executive member of the Northside Democratic Association. On behalf of the officers and members of the Northside Democratic Association, and the community of Corona, which it represents, I want to thank you for allowing me to testify. The Northside Democratic Association is one of the oldest political associations in the City of New York. It has provided political civic and social support to the Corona community for over 100 years. Unfortunately, the lines that are under consideration for the new 35th and 39th Assembly Districts inflict a devastating blow to the integrity of Corona by breaking up Corona into different Assembly Districts. Look at the shape of these districts. They have no rhyme or reason, other than joining E.D.s with other E.D.s, pursuant to the computer profile model. Once federal case law recognized that the complete exclusion of minorities from political opportunity was unconstitutional, there was an inexorable push toward the ultimate resolution of what group rights are cognizable. The definition of group rights, in turn, had to use some conception of proportionality as its base line. Unfortunately, the proposed political lines under consideration have gone to the opposite extreme. Obviously, not all districts in Queens County were drawn in this fashion. In other parts of Queens, neighborhoods are kept intact and preserved. This is especially true in the more affluent communities. I seriously question the constitutionality of drawing districts using computer profiling as the ultimate object, and urge the drafters to give equal weight to community integrity. By drafting lines to ensure community integrity, you will give all the residents of Corona a fair and equal opportunity to elect the representative who represent the entire community of Corona. Community integrity was the underlying justification urged successfully after the 1980 Census, upon a Federal Court, by the Honorable Helen Marshall, when the Court adopted the so-called Marshall Plan, and reunited the Corona community. Thank you for your consideration. SENATOR SKELOS: Thank you. Arturo Sanchez. MR. SANCHEZ: Good afternoon. Before I open up, I'd like to make a slight correction. I am being identified as a member of La Gran Alianza of Queens. I am a member of La Gran Alianza of Queens, but I'm, also, testifying as a Professor of Urban Planning at the Graduate School of Architecture and Planning of Pratt Institute. Having said that, good afternoon. My name is Arturo Ignacio Sanchez. I reside at 33-27 91st Street, Jackson Heights, Queens. Having lived in Jackson Heights since 1984, I am civically engaged in my community's well being. For example, I currently serve as a member of Community Board 3, which includes the neighborhoods of Corona, Jackson Heights, and East Elmhurst. Moreover, I have, also, served on the Board of Directors of La Gran Alianza, Queens, and Columbian Charities of America, two well known organizations that serve many of the Spanish speaking new Americans toward reinvigorating our local neighborhoods. I would, also, add that as a Professor of Urban Planning, I have published a number of scholarly articles and book chapters that address a wide range of socio-economic and demographic issues within the Jackson Heights, Corona, and surrounding neighborhoods. Today, I am here before you to testify, both as a committed community resident, and as a member of the Latino Voting Rights Committee of Metro New York. The committee is a bottom up consortium of Latino community leaders, and activists, who have consulted and worked collaboratively with a wide range of neighborhood residents, in crafting a map that outlines the geographical and socio-cultural contours for a new Queens Assembly District in northwestern Queens. The committee has designed this legislative map with great care and sensitivity for the deep social networks that mark the communities of interest that define and give social meaning to the proposed redistricting lines. In this regard today, we will hear testimony from local neighborhood residents regarding the proposed map that was designed by folks who live in this community and work for its common good. As such, in their testimony, residents will address the social, cultural and institutional dimensions that make our proposed map a first rate example of an inclusive, bottom up design process, as well as a sterling example of civic participation by a wide range of new Americans. As you know, Queens County, and specifically the Corona catchment area, is considered to be ground zero for the new Latino immigration that is transforming our city landscapes. The Census tracts that capture the highest Spanish language dominant immigrant growth rate, as well as what demographers call natural increases in population, are clustered principally within the Corona community, and the legislative map that was designed by the Latino Voting Rights Committee. In designing this legislative map, we were deeply influenced by certain overarching commonalities, that include, but are not exclusively limited to, one, the clustering of high Spanish language growth patterns in a finite number of Census tracts. Two, socio-economic characteristics, such as household income, labor force participation rates; and Three, pre and post migratory levels of educational achievement. The above mentioned commonalities both drive and define the place based communities of interest that make up our proposed legislative district. It is generally accepted by well known researchers on immigration, that international migration is a network driven process. In effect, immigrants don't migrate, networks migrate. What this means, is that the decision to migrate, resettle in a specific neighborhood, and secure employment, are significantly conditioned by immigrant networks that revolve around tightly packed social relationships. This was the case during the late 19th Century, and continues to be the case today. The contemporary immigrant networks are place based and closely associated with the emergence of local neighborhood institutions, such as ethnic associations, sport leagues, transnationalized political clubs, home town associations, churches, and local businesses to just mention a few. These institutions not only facilitate immigration, they also play an important role in the civic and political incorporation of our newest neighbors. People become engaged and committed to place by the deep social relationships that tie them to a community. In drawing up the proposed legislative district, we factored in these insights into the map making process, and in doing so, we attempted to protect our respective communities of interest, ensure that minorities have a genuine voice within the political system, and create committed stakeholders. It is, also, important to highlight that we also built upon and enriched the civic and democratic processes that marks the great American social experiment with immigrant incorporation. SENATOR SKELOS: Could you please sum up. We're trying to keep it to five minutes. MR. SANCHEZ: Okay. In this spirit, we ask you to respect and support the hard work and civic engagement that out bottom up legislative mapping project represents. During this moment of national crisis, when our core institutions and values are under attack by intolerance and terrorism, let us show our newest neighbors, the country and large, and the international community, that the United States continues to be the beacon of hope for democracy and civic participation for all. Thank you. (Applause.) SENATOR SKELOS: Any questions? MR. BONILLA: Sir, you are aware that the plan here does, in fact, create a Hispanic district, or a new minority seat for potentially an Hispanic, in the area of Corona, Jackson Heights, East Elmhurst; you are aware of that? MR. SANCHEZ: Oh, of course, I'm aware. As an urban planner, I would think that I'm aware of it. MR. BONILLA: I just wanted to make sure that you are. MR. SANCHEZ: My point of contestation with the plan that has come to us from the sate, as compared to the bottom up plan that was configured by the community based leaders and others, is that our plan is a bottom up plan, whereas the state plan is a top down plan. And in that sense, what we find, is that we find the whole question of civic engagement, from the ground up, in our community in configuring the map, that becomes very, very important in terms of developing this idea of being a stakeholder. This is part of the whole process of civic and political incorporation, that people feel that they're part of the process, number one. Number two, the problem with the state map, is that the state map goes far over into the Jackson Heights area, and includes -- if we are going to work around the working notion of communities of interest, and this idea of networks, what happens is, that there are demographic changes as you move over into Jackson Heights, in terms of income. Household income in the areas included in the state map, that factor in Jackson Heights, the household income there is higher than the household income in the Corona catchment area, and that's principally a function of household composition. Meaning, that there are -- I won't go into that, but it has much to do with household composition. Second of all, politically, all right, since we have more -- if you go in and you look at the voting patterns, the Corona district has voted overwhelmingly Democratic, both at the national and local level, whereas the more that you move into Jackson Heights, increasingly more people are registered as Independents, Latinos registered as Independents, and at the local level, they will increasingly vote less Democratic than the people that live in Corona, Queens. MR. BONILLA: Thank you very much. SENATOR SKELOS: Genaro Herrera. (NO response.) SENATOR SKELOS: Sungkyu Yun. MR. YUN: Thank you, honorable members of the Task Force. My name is Sungkyu Yun, also known as Steve Yun, and I am the Director of National Korean American Service & Education Consortium, known as NAKASEC. NAKASEC is a non-profit organization that seeks to educate and empower the Korean American community. Our major program components include legal rights advocacy, civil rights campaigns, and civic participation. NAKASEC currently has its headquarters located in Flushing, New York. My objective in this testimony is to ensure that Asian Americans have an opportunity to participate in the City's redistricting process and thereby to have a meaningful political representation in the future. After carefully reviewing the redistricting proposal and a study by the Asian American Legal Defense and Education Fund, we are satisfied with the proposal pertaining to Flushing, the strategic area with the highest number of Chinese American, as well as Korean Americans in the City, if not the country. The Asian American community, also, welcomes the prospect of having a more open Assembly District, with Asian majority in Flushing, Assembly District 22. Asian Americans, mostly Chinese and Koreans in this newly proposed district in Flushing share many common interests and concerns. They have similar voting patterns, attend the same schools, shope together in ethnic supermarkets, ride the same buses and trains to work, and they share needs in services, such as English language class or bilingual ballots. We commend the Task Force for proposing a new and Asian majority district in Flushing. The proposal, also, splits Flushing into two Senate Districts, with a significant Asian populations, 25% and 33% respectively. While we would still like to see a Senate District that incorporates the entire Flushing into a single district, we acknowledge that this proposal is an improvement over the current arrangement that divides Flushing into four Senate Districts. On the other hand, we are not too happy with areas other than Flushing, as Queens communities with substantial Asian populations, for example, Jackson Heights, Elmhurst, Woodside to name a few, would remain divided under this proposal. Just like Flushing, these neighborhoods share very similar socio-economic traits and common needs. We believe that these neighborhoods' political boundaries should not be divided. NAKASEC endorses the redistricting plan submitted to the Task Force from the Puerto Rican Legal Defense and Education Fund for this area containing Jackson Heights and Elmhurst. Under this plan, both Latinos and Asian American will have meaningful opportunities to elect candidates of their choice. Despite a large population presence, I would say up to 10% in New York City, and about 20% in Queens, and its continual growth, only on Asian American has been elected to City Council, Sate Legislature or Congressional District representing New York City, and that occurred very recently. It is critically important to have political representation that addresses the needs of the community. Previously, Asian American communities throughout New York City have been disenfranchised because our communities have been divided by unfair legislative districts. This time, we urge the Task Force to correct unfairness by uniting Asian American districts together. SENATOR SKELOS: Thank you for being here. MR. YUN: Thank you. SENATOR SKELOS: Is Mr. Herrera ready to testify? VOICE: Yes, here he comes. MR. HERRERA: Good afternoon. My name is Genaro Herrera. SENATOR SKELOS: Speak closer to the microphone. MR. HERRERA: I have been a community activist in the areas of Corona, and Jackson Heights for more than 30 years. As some of you may remember, I have testified before you in this very room last year, on June 1st. Today, as in the past, my goal is to advocate for the interests of the community. This time, my specific objective is to support the maps drawn by the Puerto Rican Legal Defense and Education Fund through the Latino Voting Rights Project. You will hear others testimonies on behalf of this plan. The speakers will be a diverse group, professionals, business owners, taxi drivers, religious leaders, labor leaders, community leaders, and long time concerned community residents. Some of the speakers will be fairly familiar with the redistricting process, and they will be able to answer questions. Others will be limited in discussing their thoughts about the actual map. Yet, virtually all of them are very closely connected to our areas of concern, Corona, Jackson Heights, Elmhurst. My brief discussion this afternoon will focus mainly in two districts that the Latino Voting Rights Project has drawn. The District 34 in Corona and part of Jackson Heights, and District 85, mostly in Jackson Heights. I will try to make a contrast between these districts and the two new ones drawn by the legislators, the 34th and the 39th. In drawing these new districts our main interests are to keep communities together, keep the community needs of all district configuration, undo past district lines, which divided minority neighborhoods, protect community interests, avoid splitting up other minority neighborhoods, and to give voters priorities, not the incumbents. We tried to keep the area of Corona together, because this community has been systematically shortchanged during the last ten years. The present lines in Assembly District 34 lump together Corona, Jackson Heights, Elmhurst and East Elmhurst. This is not an accident. This is the result of a careful planning with the intention of debilitating the political empowerment of the Corona residents. The consequences of this has been that practically all the elected officials of the area, from the Congressional persons -- Corona has been divided by three Congressional Districts -- to the Council person, Assembly person, et cetera. They have grossly neglected Corona, all the elected officials. Corona is a community of interest, because most of its residents share a common language, schools, community agencies, taxi services, local churches, businesses et cetera. More importantly, most Corona residents are unanimous in their feeling about abandonment to which it has been subjected. P.S. 19 in Corona is currently functioning at 150% of its capacity. It is one of the most overcrowded schools in New York City, and some believe, in the United States. SENATOR SKELOS: I don't want to cut you off, but we're trying to keep everybody to five minutes, so everybody could be heard. MR. HERRERA: In fact, some of the speakers are going to agree for this; can I finish? SENATOR SKELOS: I'll give you two more minutes. MR. HERRERA: Okay, thank you. According to a local paper, after observing the conditions of the school -- I'm sorry, about three years ago, the former Education Secretary visited P.S. 19. According to a local paper, after observing the condition of the school, and to the embarrassment of the borough wide federal elected official who were present, he said, children are learning in closets, in hallways, and because there is no cafeteria, the children have to eat lunch at their desks. That's P.S. 19, the most overcrowded school in New York City. Chancellor Howard Levy, who also was present, said, this is awful. All the local elected officials were there. This is awful. This is unexcusable. No pool, no gym, no outside. There's no space outside at P.S. 19. P.S. waits for the elected officials to advocate for an additional building. But, while that is happening, three new schools have been built in Jackson Heights. Another one will open in September is being constructed, also, in Jackson Heights. Four schools in two years in Jackson Heights. P.S. 19 is waiting four years for additional space. No one is caring bout it, because it's in Corona. So, our emphasis is Corona. Now, we don't want to divide Jackson Heights either. So, that's why we have a new district in Jackson Heights, because we respect Jackson Heights. Also, we respect the Asian Community. We didn't divide the Asian community in our districts, because we are working with them. So, it is important to know that District 39 is dividing the Asian community. District 39 has 24% Asians. Our district has almost 35% Asian, and that was not an accident, because we don't want to divide the minority community. Now, since I don't have more time, the new District 34 that is drawn by the Legislature, divides the communities of Jackson Heights and Woodside. The only purpose of this is to increase the white population from the current 11% in District 34 today, to 18% the white population. Now, I'm going to end by asking you a question, and you can ask me questions, also, but I would like to ask you this question. How is it that a certain group, in this case whites in Jackson Heights, increased in a district when its population, the white population in Jackson Heights, has steadily decreased for the last ten years? How come, can you help me in this; can you answer that question for me? SENATOR SKELOS: We note your concerns. MR. HERRERA: We will answer any questions you have about the maps. SENATOR SKELOS: Does anyone have any questions? (No response.) MR. HERRERA: Okay. SENATOR SKELOS: Thank you very much. MR. HERRERA: It's not possible to get an answer to my question? SENATOR SKELOS: We're really looking to get your input into what suggestions you would have into changing the proposed districts as the process goes forward. So, we really want your input, and this is what the Task Force will be looking at. MR. BONILLA: But, your point is made. MR. HERRERA: Okay, and we're willing to discuss changes with you and the Legislature, also; okay? SENATOR SKELOS: Thank you. MR. HERRERA: Thank you very much. SENATOR SKELOS: Fred Fu; is Fred here? (No response.) SENATOR SKELOS: Sister Janice Williams; is Sister Janice here? (No response.) SENATOR SKELOS: Deacon Jimmy Stillwell; are you here? (No response.) SENATOR SKELOS: James Heyliger, H-e-y-l- i-g-e-r; are you here? (No response.) SENATOR SKELOS: Ludy Herrera. (No response.) SENATOR SKELOS: Virginia Pastorini. MS. PASTORINI: I'm here. SENATOR DOLLINGER: I just want to make one other little comment before we continue. I want to just clarify. There has not been a vote yet in this Task Force on any of these plans. I just want to make clear that these are plans, that by statute, are presented for public comment in accordance with the law that says the Chairman may advance the proposals for the public comment period. I know that I, as one of the six members, and frankly, the other five, have not had a chance to vote on these plans yet. We have not approved them or disapproved them. They are here because, under New York law, the statute provides that the Chairman present plans for public comment. So, I just wanted to make that clear. MS. PASTORINI: Buenos tardes. (Witness continues testifying in Spanish.) MR. BONILLA: Gracias. SENATOR SKELOS: Carlos Suarez. MR. SUAREZ: Buenos tardes. (Witness continues testifying in Spanish.) MR. BONILLA: Gracias. SENATOR SKELOS: Petra Perez. (No response.) SENATOR SKELOS: Seymour Schwartz; is Mr. Schwartz here? (No response.) SENATOR SKELOS: Morshed Alam, A-l-a-m. Welcome. MR. ALAM: Thank you. Mr. Chairman, members of the Task Force, good afternoon. Ladies and gentlemen, it is my pleasure to speak on behalf of Asians in the new American community. My name is Morshed Alam. I am a two-time elected school board member of District 29 in Queens, and also founder and the President of the New American Democratic Club, and currently, I'm Executive Director of American Bangladesh Friendship Association. We are about 100,000 people who live in Queens. I am here not to represent any political party or politician, or not to support them. I am here to defend the Asian-American, and the Hispanic community, and also the new American community in the neighborhoods in Queens, locating the boundaries and the common interests as a community. As we all know, Asian- Americans comprises about 10% and about 20% Hispanics in New York's population. Since Asian-Americans and Hispanics are protected minority groups under the Federal Voting Rights Act, districts must be drawn so that Asian-Americans and Latino Americans can elect their candidates of their choice. Moreover, the U.S. Supreme Court has held that district must encompass communities of interest and prides this legal concept by having community residents define their own neighborhoods. I am here to support Flushing's New Asian-American district, and I want to preserve that. Number two, Corona, Elmhurst new district should be preserved, what was proposed by Puerto Rican Legal Defense Fund. And I want to say Glen Oaks, Floral Park, Queens Village, and Bellerose should be one district, then Asian-Americans, they can represent them. Number four, Richmond Hill and Ozone Park should be one district, then Asian-American, Indo- Guyanese and Hispanic can represent properly. And number five, the district drawn in Jackson Heights and Corona for Hispanic Asian, also, was proposed by Puerto Rican Legal Defense Fund, I want to support that district. For the Senate district, like you say, I found the statistics. District 13 has 27% Asian, and 16% Latino, and District 11, 25.6% Asian, and 14.4% is Hispanic, and I believe this should be one Hispanic and Asian coalition district can be drawn. I thank you for your support and help. SENATOR SKELOS: Thank you. Leonard Cutler. (No response.) SENATOR SKELOS: Is Mr. Cutler here? (No response.) SENATOR SKELOS: Mary J. Finlay. (No response.) SENATOR SKELOS: Ed Finlay. (No response.) SENATOR SKELOS: Shoshana Bleiberg. (No response.) SENATOR SKELOS: Florence Fleschner. (No response.) SENATOR SKELOS: Julia Phillips. (No response.) SENATOR SKELOS: Frances Harrison; is Frances here? (No response.) SENATOR SKELOS: Helen Barnett. (No response.) SENATOR SKELOS: Emmanuel Fox. (No response.) SENATOR SKELOS: Is Mr. Fox here? (No response.) SENATOR SKELOS: Marcia Fox. (No response.) SENATOR SKELOS: Fran Goldstein. (No response.) SENATOR SKELOS: H. Cutler. (No response.) SENATOR SKELOS: Carl Gruning. (No response.) SENATOR SKELOS: Is Mr. Gruning here? (No response.) SENATOR SKELOS: Mary Gruning. (No response.) SENATOR SKELOS: Charlotte Buchman. (No response.) SENATOR SKELOS: Robert Hoft, H-o-f-t. (No response.) SENATOR SKELOS: Robert Menshe, M-e-n-s- h-e. (No response.) SENATOR SKELOS: Marcia Gluck. (No response.) SENATOR SKELOS: Harvey Gluck. (No response.) SENATOR SKELOS: Louise Lane. (No response.) SENATOR SKELOS: Charlene Lane. (No response.) SENATOR SKELOS: Ruth Goros, G-o-r-o-s. (No response.) SENATOR SKELOS: Sol Goros. (No response.) SENATOR SKELOS: Michele Titus. (No response.) SENATOR SKELOS: Dan Tubridy. MS. GONZALEZ-JARRIN: My name is Aida Gonzalez-Jarrin. My number is 11. SENATOR SKELOS: Okay, we're going to run through the list, and then we'll come back. Dan T-u-b-r-i-b-y MR. TUBRIDY: It's d-y. My name is Dan Tubridy. I am a lifelong resident of Broad Channel, a little neighborhood in Queens. I am, also, a business man in Rockaway. I have come to this hearing to somewhat tell a story and hopefully make some type of contribution. The first comment that I want to make is probably two-fold. One, I think that this committee needs to understand that New York City, our seven or eight million strong, is really composed of little neighborhoods, like my neighborhood, like my community, and one of the things that I'm hearing here today is that we're dividing them, and I'm going to finish up with a story about when you divide a community. The second is, we here in New York City seem to be under represented when it comes to counting the numbers, and as a businessman, I sometimes refer to that as fiddling. Now, fiddling is a proper term when we're not exactly saying we're being dishonest, but we're not exactly saying that everything is black and white and on the money. I think that's one of the things that's certainly happening here when it comes to the amount of Senators that are to represent those of us here in New York City, and I would like to ask you as strong as possible, to correct that, so that fiddling, or that other word that's almost as old as our constitution, gerrymandering, does not affect our neighborhoods here in the City. Now, the story that I have to say is, ten years ago I testified to a committee such as yours on the New York City Council redistricting. They were dividing our neighborhood. They put a line right down it, dividing us. We asked them, we begged them, we're an island; how can you divide an island? They did. And I want to say to those of you here that feel very strong about that, we went to court. We sued that commission. We won. We remained as a neighborhood for our local Councilman, and we're very proud of him. I, also, want to say, it's a very conservative area. Nearly all white, not one that you would think would do something dramatic, but when term limits came for the New York City Council, we voted overwhelmingly for it. Overwhelmingly, because they fiddled with us. Those people in power fiddled with us. So, I say please, take heed. I say to those people here who are unhappy, take promise. Our courts are still strong. If you feel it is unfair, do not be afraid. Go into court. Members of the committee, don't fiddle with us. Keep our neighborhoods intact. Give us the amount of Senators that we need. Thank you very much. ASSEMBLYMEMBER ORTLOFF: May I ask you a question, please? I take your -- I take your meaning to heart, but I respectfully suggest that you've applied it in the wrong place. MR. TUBRIDY: I'm not applying it any place. Fiddling is fiddling, whether it's the Senate, the Assembly, whether it's Congress, whether it's Councilman. ASSEMBLYMEMBER ORTLOFF: Well, let me ask you -- MR. TUBRIDY: Fiddling is fiddling. ASSEMBLYMEMBER ORTLOFF: How many seats in the Assembly should the City of New York have? MR. TUBRIDY: Wouldn't know. ASSEMBLYMEMBER ORTLOFF: Should it be proportional to the population? MR. TUBRIDY: I -- I -- again, I'm going to make it very clear, when you fiddle with the numbers, the numbers have to come somewhat on the money. I mean, if you want to go around -- ASSEMBLYMEMBER ORTLOFF: Let me ask you a more direct question. MR. TUBRIDY: Sure. ASSEMBLYMEMBER ORTLOFF: The two black numbers, the two numbers in black, which one is the bigger one? MR. TUBRIDY: The top one. ASSEMBLYMEMBER ORTLOFF: That's the population of the upstate 55 counties. MR. TUBRIDY: Right. ASSEMBLYMEMBER ORTLOFF: The lower one is the five counties in New York City. Upstate has more people than New York City. This is the proportional number of seats in the Assembly. I don't suppose you know how many seats in the Assembly the plan gives New York City. MR. TUBRIDY: No, I don't. ASSEMBLYMEMBER ORTLOFF: Well, instead of 63, it gives it 65. MR. TUBRIDY: A back and forth of the numbers. ASSEMBLYMEMBER ORTLOFF: That's correct. The Assembly plan actually reverses the order of the size of the two sections. I would submit that the Senate plan respects that, and I do appreciate your -- MR. TUBRIDY: Well, what I -- ASSEMBLYMEMBER ORTLOFF: -- comments on fiddling, but -- MR. TUBRIDY: What I -- ASSEMBLYMEMBER ORTLOFF: -- I hope you will join us if there's a court case on this, that you'll be right there in the front row with us. MR. TUBRIDY: I'll make the same $10.00 contribution to our last court case, that I'll make to that court case. Again, I'm not trying to -- I appreciate everybody that comes down here and talks to us and listens to us, but I tried to make it very clear, that if you want to understand why we, you know, out here are frustrated, why we threw our City Council out, they were fiddling with us. If it's the Assembly, so bet it. If it's the Senate, so be it. When you fiddle, you fiddle. It's not quite wrong, but it's not right. SENATOR SKELOS: I would like to point out that with the Senate, the 62nd seat, the additional seat, goes to New York City, so that the upstate number of Senate seats are the same, Long Island is the same, and New York City takes one additional seat. MR. TUBRIDY: Terrific. Thank you. SENATOR SKELOS: Thank you. Gary White; is Gary here? MR. WHITE: Yes. SENATOR SKELOS: Great. MR. WHITE: Good afternoon. My name is Gary White. I am active with the Junior Chamber of Commerce, an organization of young professionals, 21 to 39. The Junior Chamber of Commerce encourages civic involvement such as this. However, I am here to contribute my personal experience as a resident of Richmond Hill. I have a simple request, which is to keep Richmond Hill, Ozone Park together. In the 17 years that I've resided in Richmond Hill, I have witnessed an influx of West Indian and East Indian immigrants, which includes my family. We are from Guyana. I have three sets of aunts, uncles and cousins, living within walking distance of my home, and we own and operate businesses in Richmond Hill. We, also, actively participate in the voting process. I ask that you not support the current proposal dividing Richmond Hill. Like other residents, the current proposal risks dividing common family interests. I urge the panel to redraw the Richmond Hill, Ozone Park district lines to keep the community together. Do you have any questions? SENATOR SKELOS: Thank you, sir. I'm going to have a problem with the name, and I apologize, S-u-p-r-a-b-h-a-t, last name is S-e-n-g-u-p-t-a. Welcome. MR. SENGUPTA: Honorable members of the Task Force committee, my name is Suprabhat Sengupta. It is not very difficult to pronounce. Suprabhat means good morning, and you can't forget my name. SENATOR SKELOS: As the list is growing, it may be a good morning. (Laughter.) MR. SENGUPTA: But, I want to make it brief. I won't take much of your time, because everybody is speaking for quite a long time, but I will make it brief, but I want to make my point. Let me say this. I am in engineering profession, and I have been in this country for 32 years, and I have contributed a lot myself. I am a member of eight professional societies, and a life member of many American societies. But, to make it brief, the reason I am here, we came to this country 32 years ago, and a lot of Indians have migrated from India and other parts of the world, and America is such a beautiful country, America has absorbed each and every national from different parts of the world. I thank America, and I am glad that I'm here, and I'm a proud U.S. citizen. But, the point is this I want to make. We cannot forget our roots, our culture, and all the things we have given to this country. There are a lot of professionals, like doctors, scientists, engineers, computer professionals all over the United States. They have contributed a lot to make our lives better in the United States. But, unfortunately, nobody has represented yet in the government yet, at the state, city or federal level. I support -- I am a Democrat, and I have worked with Hillary Clinton, and she won the race. I worked with Gary Ackerman, Congressman. I worked very closely with Chuck Schumer and other Democrats. But, I want to stress this point. Let us do it in such a way, redefine the geographic areas in such a way, that there should be some Indian who should come to the government and see the difficult problems we face should be brought to the government level in either city, state or Congress. That is my only request, and I would appreciate if you can listen to us and provide in such a way that Indians are represented in the government. I, of course, agree with Dr. Rajkaumar, who presented before, and thank you for your time. SENATOR SKELOS: Thank you for taking the time to be here. Rene Lobo. MS. LOBO: Good evening, and thank you for letting me have the time. A very quick brief introduction about myself. I am a News Director, Producer and Host on International Channel and, also, a community activist, as well as I ran for City Council last year from District 29. I almost feel shortchanged, because everybody has almost said their testimonies, but nevertheless, first of all, I'd like to congratulate the Flushing community for getting an Asian American on board. At this point in time, that's what we are thinking. So, it's good news that Asians are moving up. But, at the same time it's not enough. There are Asians not just in Flushing. There are Asians in Bellerose, Floral Park, Richmond Hill, Ozone Park, Rego Park where I come from, and Queens Village, and other areas as well. In fact, there are over 800,000 Asians and the Census report says that we make up almost 10% of the New York City population, and one out of every four Asians happens to be a South Asian, and 60% of that South Asian population resides in Queens, and yet we do not have an Assemblyman, Assemblywoman, a Senator or somebody in Congress, and we can only have a meaningful representation or active political participation if some other things are taken care of, and I just want to point out a few things. First of all, the 1965 Federal Voting Rights Act entails that Asians are a protected minority group, which means we can elect a candidate of our own choice. Now, to elect the candidate of our own choice, we need to have communities of interest intact. That, again, is a Supreme Court decision that was upheld some years ago, to keep those sharing the same interests, same concerns, intact. Now, if you splinter Richmond Hill and Ozone Park in four to five A.D.s, 25, 27, 31, 32, and 38, it just not only splinters a district, it splinters the minds of a lot of Asian Americans and Caribbeans, because then they can't vote in the way they want, and this only perpetuate the myth that Asian Americans do not vote. How can they vote if you do not have your own candidate of your own choice? When you go behind the curtain and put a cross by somebody's name, you're giving that person and yourself political empowerment. But, if you can't decide who to vote for, because now it's been splintered into four to five A.D.s, there's no snowball's chance in hell that they're going to decide what to do and, again, it perpetuates the same myth that Asians can't vote. The other myth that Asians have going for themselves, and I think somebody asked earlier, what it means to be South Asian. I've been a News Director, Producer and Host for International Channel. What they're doing is basically keeping South Asians and the Caribbean community together. I don't say I'm an Indian American, and I don't say that one is a Pakistani or a Bangladeshi, or a Sri Lankan or a Caribbean. We put them all in one voting block. To put them in one voting block, what we're doing is we're giving them more political muscle and political clout. And if you say, oh, well, a lot of South Asians don't get along with each other, they have their own differences, sure. Even husbands and wives have their differences. Siblings have their differences. We sure have our own differences, but within that identity, we have this identity of a South Asian and a Caribbean community, so we should be put together. So, I urge you all, the lawmakers, when you draw the final lines, you know, see that we do not get hindered, hampered and handicapped when we're going out to vote, because nevertheless, they're never going to vote, because they're going to feel, I don't know who I'm voting for. So, it doesn't work well for those who are running again. I'm definitely going to be running again; why? Because the very fact that District 29, the part of Richmond Hill that I had, that was the northern part of Richmond Hill, I got an overwhelming majority in that area, simply because they could identify with me. They could feel that, okay, I come from their roots, their traditions, and that's the reason I urge all lawmakers, and the New York State Legislative Task Force to see this, and I'm sure that when we're talking about those five A.D.s, we have Ms. Pheffer, Vivian Cook, and Seminaro, let them keep giving the Richmond Hill and Ozone Park areas back to us, so that we can be politically empowered, have our political muscle, and keep that clout moving, so we do not keep that myth that Asians don't vote or Asians fight amongst themselves. Thank you very much for your time. SENATOR SKELOS: Thank you, ma'am. Alejo Castillo. MR. CASTILLO: Buenos tardes. (Witness testifying in Spanish.) SENATOR SKELOS: Excuse me, one minute. The prior testimony will be translated, we will have that translated. I've just been informed that we do have somebody that can translate the testimony in to English, so I would like to bring that person in at this time. MR. CASTILLO: Good afternoon. My name is Alejo Castillo. I'm here to give support to the Puerto Rican Legal Defense and Education Fund. I support what this organization has done in regard to District 34. I know the Queens area, because I had resided in Queens previously, in Corona. Because I have a lot of connections, family, as well as friends, cultural as well as political, as well as beliefs and nationality. Fundamentally, I know the Queens area because I have been a member for ten years of a Christian church in the area. Such church is located at 45th Avenue between Streets 104th and 108th. In other words, the center of Corona. Actually, at this moment, in the church I have the position of Superintendent of the church. It's a type of Christian coordinator. This job allows me to be in contact at all times with the children, adolescents, young people and adults. The heads of households that make up our congregation, whose members come from different countries from Latin America. This relationship has allowed me to get to know the idiosyncracies of this community, to get to know their needs, its fights, its pains, its joys, its triumphs, frustrations, goals, et cetera. For such reasons, I testify that such -- this community possesses many common needs, which unify it and makes it compact, which makes it become one. One of the things that unites the community is the common language in more than 70% of the households and because of such cultural ties, musical, literary, great affinity in the political ideology, and an important factor its religious affinities in believing in one single God. Our community has unity in the ways that it uses to satisfy its most urgent needs, like how to use the taxi companies, the same supermarkets, the same clothing stores, grocery stores, restaurants, the same libraries, newspapers, the same stadiums, the same movie theaters, the same TV stations, and the same schools for their children, and many times the same universities, on occasions the same jobs, factories and sewing, and the same means to advance. And even though it is true that many don't possess the same characteristics at all, it goes without saying that the socio-economic factors are such that it is impossible to separate them all. These common characteristics are tied and rooted within the parameters and the lines of the political district that we have elaborated and that we depend on. We ask that -- we want these geographical lines to be the ones that make such a district, because these are the lines that protect the community. We want the guarantee that from here come out the voices, the genuine voices that defend our community. The voices that will fight to fix our schools, and to make better function our libraries, in need of the proper material. Corona has been a community that has been forgotten for the actual incumbents. We need that it is given priority to voters, not to the actual incumbents. We need a community united. We need a just representation, like the one we have elaborated, not like the one that we have at the moment that has divided the power of the community. To this, we say not, it is not just that the districts be created to separate and harm the minority groups. No. Ladies and gentlemen, I congratulate for having in your hands the enormous privilege to make justice for a noble community that is trying to get ahead. God is infinitely just, and he wants us to be just, otherwise some day God's justice will come to us. I finish by making these comments. Make good use of what God has allowed you to have in your hands. Make justice. God bless you. Thank you very much. (Applause.) SENATOR SKELOS: Michael Bookbinder. (No response.) SENATOR SKELOS: Leyland Roopnaraine, R- o-o-p-n-a-r-a-i-n-e. MR. ROOPNARAINE: Mr. Chairman, ladies and gentlemen, I thank you all for this opportunity to be here. SENATOR SKELOS: Welcome. MR. ROOPNARAINE: Normally, I'm a very reserved person, but after looking at the map that has been drawn, that is the proposed redrawing of the district, I feel very compelled to be here. Let me begin by saying that the history of the world is essentially a history of drawing boundaries, drawing lines. However, when these lines are drawn, people's lives become altered, people's lives change. Moreover, when these lines are drawn without favor or consent of those who these lines embrace, people withdraw, people become disconcerted, discontented, and they eventually withdraw their skills, and their capital and other aspects of life. It needs not to be overstated that is this neighborhood, and I refer specifically to Assembly District 31 and 32, that wherever and whenever we decide to redraw these lines, I guess, the intent would be to foster good harmony and create good will among all those who live there. Of course, I understand this venture will be undertaken by men of great integrity and intelligence. However, it has been my experience that not all intelligentsia is progressive. Here is a very noble example. Richmond Hill, a community of some 60,000 Guyanese residents, has as a proposal to be divided into five Assembly Districts, which by any law of reasonable deduction is a ridiculous proposal all together. Here is this little tiny village that has to be divided into five Assembly Districts. What happens here is that when this community votes, these votes cancel each other, they negate each other. So, in effect, the people of Richmond Hill cannot vote purposefully. It has been the experience of all here that people tend to vote in block, in mass, and if this Legislature is proposing to divide up this district, what will happen is that the people here will have no say in their community, no say in their activities, and moreover, the same community, having been split into several districts, will be vying for the same funds. I find the concept of using a computer printout to divide a district is a very poor concept, when you're considering the social lives of people who live here. Let me, also, add that as a very simple proposal, this part of the district of Richmond Hill and its environs, should be incorporated into one electoral district -- one Assembly District, I mean, for the very simple reason that everyone there can have a say, as opposed to dividing it into several other constituents. My proposal is that the area of Jamaica Avenue, going towards 111th Street, ending at the South Conduit, and coming on the Van Wyck Expressway, is pretty much a rectangle in shape. That particular area, which is mainstay Richmond Hill, should be a part of an Assembly District, perhaps, Assembly District 31 or 32. As it stands here now, we are dividing up the district. In conclusion, let me basically say that it is a sad scenario all together, to see a district so small like this having to be divided into five Assembly Districts, because this makes no progress for the people who live there. The Fourteenth Amendment of the Constitution guarantees equal protection and equal opportunity. This is definitely not the case here. It would, perhaps, be more appropriate to quote the words of George Orwell in "Animal Farm", all are equal, but some animals are more equal than others. Thank you. SENATOR SKELOS: Senator Dollinger has a question. SENATOR DOLLINGER: It's actually more in the form of a comment. We've heard several speakers talk about portions of Queens that are divided, and I just want you to know that we've been in other parts of the state earlier this week, where we've heard just the opposite message. We went to Buffalo, where they had eight Assemblyman in the City of Buffalo, and the new plan only had three, and their comment was, at least several members of the public walked in and said, give us back some of the people that we had before. We went to the City of Rochester, where I'm from, and quite frankly, they had four members of the Assembly, they were reduced to three, and they said give us back more members, because then we have greater clout, because we have more people who represent a part of our community and, therefore, we have more opportunity to influence them. Just tell me how you react to that other option? MR. ROOPNARAINE: Each district is peculiar in its own likes and dislikes, and as you said, people are looking for a particular clout. This particular clout will come if the whole of Richmond Hill belongs to one particular district. As it stands on your proposal if you divide Richmond Hill, when the votes are counted, they will all be canceled out. They are negated. So, here is a community that wants to go forward, wants to participate in American mainstream political life, social life, cultural life, but they're prevented from doing so simply because of the drawing of the lines. SENATOR SKELOS: Thank you. Any other questions? ASSEMBLYMEMBER ORTLOFF: Maybe I could help you out a little bit there. SENATOR DOLLINGER: Just if I could finish. But, my question is, if the community had input on five members of the Assembly, rather than just one, it is your position that they would be better off having half of one position of an Assembly District, rather than the other five, vis-a-vis their clout, because if there were close elections, certainly those five portions, or the portions of Richmond Hill in those five Assembly Districts could be decisive in a close election. Isn't that a possibility, that, in essence, the community had greater clout, because it had the ability to influence five Assembly elections, rather than just one. MR. ROOPNARAINE: That's not the point here. The point I'm making is if they have influence with five Assembly Districts, their influence becomes null, because they cancel each other out, because the whole voting population splits up the vote. So that, in effect, they have no voice whatsoever. However, if they remain in one district, that will count. ASSEMBLYMEMBER ORTLOFF: Maybe I could -- Senator Dollinger, you made this comment before. You addressed the people in Ontario County, on the same respect. But, let me point out to my friend here, who is articulating for his community, that the analogy that was drawn is not quite apt. The City of Buffalo has three entire -- two and a half entire districts of its own already, and the question there is should they have a little piece of five or six more. The City of Rochester has two members entirely. You don't have any; is that correct? MR. ROOPNARAINE: No, we don't have any, that's why we're trying to get somebody. ASSEMBLYMEMBER ORTLOFF: So, if I take your point, what you're saying is, before you ask us if we can share a few, give us at least one of our own. MR. ROOPNARAINE: Exactly. ASSEMBLYMEMBER ORTLOFF: Thank you. MR. ROOPNARAINE: By not dividing Richmond Hill, people will have an opportunity to participate. If you divide it up, all that opportunity is washed away. ASSEMBLYMEMBER ORTLOFF: Can I ask you one further question that intrigues me? Suppose Richmond Hill was entirely in one Assembly District, and suppose it became generally known that the South Asian community in Richmond Hill had some political clout, and suppose you began to see the fruits of that in cricket fields, and in new facilities that were more appropriate to sustaining and nurturing the culture, do you supposed that over the next ten years that you would grow more as a community, if that scenario were true, and gain more political clout or do you suppose that I am not reading you correctly? MR. ROOPNARAINE: We will grow more, and we will -- and others will learn from us, like we will learn from other communities as well. ASSEMBLYMEMBER ORTLOFF: So, for those who say you don't quite have -- you probably have 20,000 in -- MR. ROOPNARAINE: 60,000 Guyanese. ASSEMBLYMEMBER ORTLOFF: Right in that area. You don't have 60,000 Asians in Richmond Hill, you have 60,000 people in Richmond Hill. MR. ROOPNARAINE: What we identify with the South Asian people -- ASSEMBLYMEMBER ORTLOFF: Correct. If you had 20,000 today, and you had one Assembly District, it would seem to me that over the next ten years, the networks that we've talked about of immigration would lead more people of South Asian descent, and South Asian immigrants to, perhaps, settle there, because you have a political identity that we have helped create. MR. ROOPNARAINE: Well, sir, when it comes to the immigration issue, historically, a decade or go, perhaps, Richmond Hill was not what it is today. It was not a depressed area, but it was a semi depressed area. Today, Richmond Hill is one of the most booming communities in this area, and you can check that out with records to show that it's packed with business, with stores, and there's a high amount of real estate turnover. I'm a real estate broker by profession. SENATOR SKELOS: Thank you very much. MR. ROOPNARAINE: Thank you, sir. SENATOR SKELOS: Kawal Totaram, T-o-t-a- r-a-m, Queens Caribbean Bar Association. MR. TOTARAM: Good afternoon, Mr. Chairman, and members of the Task Force. My name is Kawal Totaram. I am an attorney, and I happen to be the Public Relations Officer of the Queens Caribbean Bar Association. The Queens Caribbean Bar Association in as much as its a Caribbean Bar Association, we serve people of all colors, all race, all ethnicity, all religion, and we encompass the area of -- we practice entirely in New York State, but more particularly in the Richmond Hill area, in the South Ozone Park area, the Ozone Park area, Queens Village and part of Jamaica. Now, the place where I come from Guyana, some 20 years ago, what we are doing here is a rarity. And, therefore, I am grateful and happy to be here to make the presentation. In Guyana we go through the motions sometimes. Here, I hope we will not go through the motions, but there will be some concrete opinion, or something will come out of this situation. Everyone will not be happy, but certainly our voices will be heard. I live in this community, I practice in this community. I happen to be a community activist, so to speak, so I can say without fear of contradiction, that I have a good knowledge, a working knowledge of this community. We have our problems in this community. It reminds me, and I don't want to lecture to you with due respect, but it reminds me of the old colonial days when everything was shipped out of the colonial people to Great Britain, the taxes and the raw materials. It reminds me of American history, when the British was here, all the raw materials, and everything was shipped to Britain, but yet, we were taxed. In Richmond Hill today, we are being taxed, and there are poor facilities in return. What do we have today? We are being told by the politicians, listen, you cannot live in your basement. So, find somewhere else. And when we ask them, where do we live? They say, we don't have lands to build houses. Yet at the same time, we have megastores being opened in Rockaway. We have Big Taters being opened on Jamaica Avenue; and Who does it serve; does it serve the people in this community? It serves a few politicians. We have sanitation problems in this community. We have more parking tickets, and more parking meters. More taxation, less representation. So, this community needs representation. Now, when I look at a cursory look at this map, that this community represents here, and I'm sure my learned friend alluded to this, we look that here in Richmond Hill, here in Queens Village, it's split by 11 districts. 11 districts. These people are split by 11 districts. What we are asking if you to give us serious consideration that we need somebody to represent our people. We do not speak just solely because of Indianness, or West Indianness, but this is an area that a lot of people, but the majority happens to be Asian people, West Indian people. True, sir, your argument has some bearing, but with respect, when you have the district split up, politicians only listen to votes. They don't listen to what influence you make. So, that if Richmond Hill is split up into 11 districts, then if 100 people go and tell Mr. So and So, here is our influence, he doesn't care, because that sector of the people do not put him in office. So, what we are asking you is to create a district that would have a racial balance, cultural balance, and economic balance so that all can be represented. It is, therefore, I urge you to consider seriously the Richmond Hill area, the South Richmond Hill area, Jamaica and Queens Village as one Assembly District. Thank you very much, and I am prepared to answer any questions that the panel may have. SENATOR SKELOS: Thank you very much, sir. MR. TOTARAM: Thank you. SENATOR SKELOS: Farley A-r-r-i-a-g-a; are you here? (No response.) SENATOR SKELOS: Lucia Gomez. MS. GOMEZ: Good afternoon. I am the Civic Participation Program Coordinator for the Puerto Rican Legal Defense and Education Fund, that I guess you've heard mentioned a couple of times. This is my first time being here, although I have testified in numerous places throughout the country, and I would have to say this is, thus far, the most exciting one I've been to yet. During the last round of redistricting hearings, the Task Force heard a series of complaints, as well as recommendations in order to ensure that the people in the State of New York could properly participate and be active participants during this round of legislative redistricting. Since then, there is very little that the Task Force has done to remedy this apparent closed door redistricting process. The Task Force has only succeeded in excluding voters and, therefore, must now sit through hours and hours of angry frustrated voter commentary. First of all, you were asked to develop and publish the criteria you will be using in terms that are accessible to the general public, and in languages other than English, as the hearing notices were, in Chinese, Spanish and English. So, people are expecting the same type of respect in other ways in which the Redistricting Task Force actually goes forward with their plans. So when you hear people testifying in the language of their choice, it's because the public notices are, also, in languages of their choice and, therefore, they don't state that you cannot come and speak in the language of your choice. Including informing the public in a timely matter of such things as a decision to change the number of State Senate Districts. Instead, you only inform the public of such a change when you officially released your plan. No rationale, to date, has been given, neither on your web site or in writing to the public, as to why, if this change was solely due to population growth, as I have seen the web site, and I do know that you have a document on the web site, as convoluted as some people might say it is, you do have a document, your legal jargon and interpretations might suffice your colleagues, but the residents of New York City who live, work and pay taxes, demand an answer to why they will now have less of a voice in the State Senate. Seeing that you have not proposed any Congressional lines, I strongly suggest that you reassess your criteria when apportioning these districts throughout the state. For the record, any further recommendation for loss of political strength from downstate will be hard fought both in the political arena, as well as in the courts. Secondly, it couldn't have been stressed enough during the last round of hearings, that you must hold these public hearings during hours accessible to the public. What is the sense of holding these hearings during regular working hours, if not to limit the participation by the working class citizen and, therefore, disproportionately impact the population of New York City and New York City minorities. Once again, these tactics only further fuel the notion, and the assumption, that this Task Force is discriminating against the 65% non-white population of New York City. Those are not assumptions you want the community to have. Thirdly, we ask the Task Force to develop a process to give serious consideration to our own proposed plans. It was like a waiting game every time we call the different Task Force offices. No one in the offices knew when the plans would be out, or up until when we could actually be receiving public plans. We were just told, time and time again, in about two weeks, and that was, actually, towards the end of October. At one point, we even got someone on the phone who angrily answered our question on what different formats we should expect to submit our plans, because we can get somewhat technical, and in fact she answered, you don't draw the maps, we draw the maps, and they're not out yet. Furthermore, the inability for the public to actively participate in this process is further emphasized by the lack of public access terminals with the available software data and tools needed to work the numbers and the geography to assist in the understanding of the impact this is being -- these lines are making on neighborhoods. Also, the files provided with the district by district maps, are inconsistent with their data and their presentation, and not all of the maps provide street names or even district labels that assist in the identification of street boundaries and neighborhood impact further not allowing people to truly understand the way in which their neighborhoods are being divided or kept intact. Further, you do not have party affiliation breakdowns for your proposed districts available on line in a summarized fashion by district. To neither provide voting tabulation district data, and the PO94-171 Census data in order for some very experienced user to merge political data with Census data and tie in the geography data is enough barriers to suggest the community is being shut out, and the old boys network -- no offense, Debra -- continues to dictate what should be a democratic process. Finally, it either took many speakers during the last round of hearings, saying how disgusting the composition of this Task Force was, when 38% of the State of New York is non-white, and yet this Task Force was 100% white, or it could have been many trips made by Governor Pataki to our wonderful Caribbean waters, that convinced Senator Bruno to appoint a Latino surnamed individual to the Task Force. Whatever took him over the edge, I hope it happens to all of you, and you can work towards remedying a disproportionate Senatorial representation in New York City, correct the throne protecting Assembly District boundaries, that on the surface look ideal, but unnecessarily tear at the fabric of our neighborhoods throughout New York City and as I've heard many other testimonies throughout New York State, and in particular Queens, as many of you have already heard, and truly take a step forward towards providing real access to all people of New York not just a select few with expensive equipment and technical expertise. Thank you. (Applause.) SENATOR SKELOS: Questions. (No response.) SENATOR SKELOS: I'm very happy that you did point out that Senator Bruno, the Republican Majority Leader of the Senate, did appoint Mark Bonilla, of Puerto Rican ancestry, to the Task Force, and -- MS. GOMEZ: We were questioning what exactly he was. So, thank you for that clarification. SENATOR SKELOS: We're delighted with that, and as we said at the prior hearings, we had hoped that Senator Connor would have made an appointment. We're delighted that Mark is here. Senator Connor is the Democrat Minority Leader of the Senate. MS. GOMEZ: PRLDEF is a non-partisan institution -- SENATOR SKELOS: I understand. MS. GOMEZ: -- and we look for the betterment of the community. SENATOR SKELOS: I understand. MS. GOMEZ: Thank you. SENATOR SKELOS: Perry Reich. MR. REICH: Thank you Senator Skelos. SENATOR SKELOS: You're welcome. MR. REICH: In light of what the last speaker said, I'm going to change my remarks a little bit, because I take very much of an opposite view point, and Mr. Bonilla, I want to thank you for being on the commission. I know you were appointed on the commission on the basis of merit, okay, and for someone -- MR. BONILLA: I think so. MR. REICH: -- for someone to try to say something to the contrary is really almost contemptible, and please accept my apology for the community if there was any such suggestion of that. I know how hard it is to really draft and cut lines in something like this. I'm an attorney, and you're not aware you cut a line. Wherever you draw a line, somebody is going to be unhappy. This is a very, very, very hard thing to do. I really think it took guts to take an extra Senate seat and put it in New York City, because what happens is, there comes a point in time where the districts will become, either too large to really take into account the community concerns, somehow we're seeing that in some respects in the Congressional districts, where, for example, we had a district that went from Suffolk to Nassau and Queens, and these districts that were drawn on the Senate plan did not do that. I mean, they tried to take into account community concerns. I've looked at the new district that's going to be in Brooklyn. I think that that's taking into account very much community concerns. Insofar as Queens has been concerned, I've lived here all my life. Senator Padavan has been my Senator for many years. I don't always agree with Senator Padavan on some things, but I'm very glad that he's there, and I'm glad that the lines take into account the fact that someone, who has been servicing our community, is going to be remaining there, and I think that, by and large, the Senate lines in Queens do that. In addition to which, by getting that extra Senator in New York, I think, New York City's clout, in some respects, has been increased, because we have an extra number now in the Senate. Now, of course, the Assembly plan is not able to do that because in the Assembly, you have a circumstance where the State Constitution doesn't authorize an increase in the amount of seats. But, I think the Senate plan, insofar as that's concerned, takes the populational count, tries to, as best you can, maintain the community districts. As a matter of fact, the Senate plan increases, I think, an Hispanic district, it is my understanding, and that was somewhat of a tradeoff. In order to keep the communities together, that was necessary, and I think that that was the right thing to do. Although I'm from New York City, and obviously I'm delighted that the Assembly plan, in some respects, increases the proportionality of New York City, I don't know whether I feel it very fair, because the tradeoff has been that we're going to have -- I mean, the upstate areas are going to have 22 incumbents running against 22 others, and -- SENATOR SKELOS: 26. MR. REICH: 26. I wonder how that came about. Really, if we're coming down to anything, you have to be fair all the way around, and I really would hope that that's going to be done. As I say, I think the committee overall should be thanked, because this is a thankless job to do this. But, I think if it can be done, I think it's fair not to draw cul de sacs, so that an incumbent has to run against another incumbent. With that, I thank you for hearing me out today. SENATOR SKELOS: Thank you. Mohammed Sadiq, S-a-d-i-q. Welcome. MR. SADIQ: Thank you. Good evening, panel. My name is Mohammed Sadiq and I am the resident of Queens Village. I'm, also, the Recording Secretary of Queens Village Civic Association, and the Community Advisory Board member at Queens Hospital Center. I would like to give my opinion at this hearing of the redistricting of our neighborhood. According to the United States Census 2000, among all Asians, 45% are Chinese, 12% are Korean, and 30% are South Asians, which include Asian Indians, Bangladeshis, Pakistanis, and Indo-Caribbeans in the borough of Queens. The majority of the residents in Bellerose, Floral Park, Queens Village, Hollis, Jamaica Hills, Jamaica Estates, and Briarwood are Asians. In redistricting, communities of common interest must be reflected within the geographic boundaries. South Asians reside in a growing numbers in the above mentioned neighborhoods. But, this community is divided into two Assembly Districts, 24 and 33. This results in common ideas being split up by two districts. Because of this, a small percentage of South Asians are resident in both districts, therefore, leaving South Asians unable to speak for their community. Look at the Hillside Avenue, starting at the Van Wyck Expressway, to the city boundary line in the east at Floral Park. Tremendous amounts of South Asian business are growing on both sides of the street. These are the restaurants, fast foods, supermarkets, gas stations, real estate, doctor's office, car dealers, and laundromats all over the places are all Indian owned, and South Asians. Along with the cultural aspects of this community, religion plays a role here, too. We have churches, mosques, synagogues, Hindu mandirs, Sikh temples and Buddhist temples. Yet, Hillside Avenue seems to be the dividing line of the South Asian community, which separates us into districts. The most shocking of them all is that we are detached into the north and the south of two districts. When I moved to Queens Village in 1985, I was welcomed by Irish American neighbors. Now, I am welcoming many of the newcomers in my neighborhood with our South Asians. The whole demographic has changed over the first few years. I have a suggestion for the boundary lines for the Assembly Districts that can save the South Asian community. The boundary should go north to Union Turnpike, south to Jamaica Avenue, east to the city boundary line, and west to the Van Wyck Expressway. There are communities of interest that must not be divided when district lines are redrawn. The united voice of South Asian communities, who have the same common goals, will soon develop a better quality of life. When the South Asian will be united as one, we will be able to develop a strong ethnically oriented neighborhood, just like many other various major communities. That is what America is, a melting pot of diversity. Thank you. SENATOR SKELOS: Thank you very much. Are there any questions? (No response.) SENATOR SKELOS: Thank you. MR. SADIQ: Thank you. SENATOR SKELOS: Murray Berger. MR. BERGER: I was giving myself till 5:30. SENATOR SKELOS: Pardon me? MR. BERGER: I was giving myself till 5:30 before I left. SENATOR SKELOS: Thanks for staying. MR. BERGER: Thank you. I'm here not to critique anything, because I don't know what the plans are. I learned about this hearing today, from somebody who saw the Chronicle, and as Chairman of the Kew Gardens Civic Association, our association received no notification on the hearing either from the Task Force, nor from the Community Board. I think it's deplorable that you don't have a wall sized map here so that those of us here can look and point to different things. You don't even have an 8-1/2, 11 map here, which I think is a terrible oversight on somebody's part. All I know about the redistricting is what the Times has carried and said, insofar as Kew Gardens is concerned, we're about a one square mile neighborhood. Borough Hall, this building, is the northern end of Kew Gardens, and we extend about a mile south of here and a mile east of here. All I know about its impact on us is, Dan Hevesi faces dissolution by being absorbed into Toby Stavisky's district, and that's all I've gleaned from an article in the Times a week or two ago. So, I wish I could speak intelligently about your proposal if I knew more about it. I would hope that we could send material in, that we could find out more from your office, and that we could follow up with correspondence in writing, correspondence with our comments after studying what you're proposing. Would that go to the Broadway office? SENATOR SKELOS: Yes. MR. BERGER: We now have three Assemblymen and two Senators, and it's a mixed bag. We have the advantage of having five people in Albany whom we can go to, but at the same time, we're a small cog in each of their districts. So, it works both ways. I would hope, gentlemen, that after the dust has settled, and after you get a more representative reaction from the public, that you hold another public hearing with districts on display, so that people can react somewhat more intelligently. From my observation of this afternoon's hearing, it seems to be you seem to have mostly people here who are focused on a particular issue, and who were brought here on an organized effort to bring out a group of people. I don't see a cross section of all of Queens here by any means. I would hope that you would come back and let us enjoy talking to you in that ambiance. I thank you. SENATOR SKELOS: Thank you. I just want to point out to you, sir, that the Task Force has spent almost $144,000 -- MR. BERGER: Not well spent. SENATOR SKELOS: -- in advertising in the newspapers about the -- MR. BERGER: Not well spent. SENATOR SKELOS: Okay, about the meetings, and there were -- MR. BERGER: I tried -- I tried downloading you, incidentally, and you wouldn't come -- it wouldn't download. SENATOR SKELOS: There were approximately up to this point, 75 people that had signed up, and I would say, 30 of them or so have opted not to come. MR. BERGER: I hear you. Thank you. SENATOR SKELOS: Thank you. Yvonne Williamson. MS. WILLIAMSON: Good afternoon. SENATOR SKELOS: Welcome. MS. WILLIAMSON: Good afternoon, Chairman and members. Again, as your predecessor says, I was thrown into this unexpectedly so I am not prepared. I am from Councilmember James Sanders office, and he asked me to come and speak on behalf of Senator Malcolm Smith. Particularly in the community of Far Rockaway, it's a small peninsula, and he is asking that you really take it into consideration when drawing your lines. The community is small, it's working, so why break it up? So, please, just take that into consideration. We would like to keep Malcolm Smith as our Senator on the whole peninsula. It is a small community, I'm just asking that you not break it up. Thank you. SENATOR SKELOS: We've run through the list of everybody that has signed up to this point. We're going to now run through the list starting with number one, again. Glenn Magpantay; is Glenn here? MR. MAGPANTAY: Good afternoon. SENATOR SKELOS: Thank you. MR. MAGPANTAY: My name is Glenn Magpantay, I'm a staff attorney at the Asian American Legal Defense and Education Fund. AALDEF is the first organization on the East Coast to defend the civil rights of Asian Americans. We do this in litigation, legal advocacy and community education. Our work on voting rights has included enforcement of the Federal Voting Rights Act, bilingual ballot, election reform, anti Asian voting discrimination, and redistricting. We submitted testimony to comment on the impact of the proposed State Senate and State Assembly District plans on the ability of Asian Americans to elect candidates of their choice, in accordance with the Voting Rights Act, and the United States Constitution. We believe that the redistricting plan, in some instances, dilutes the voting strength of Asian Americans and other racial and ethnic minority groups, first, by systematically placing overpopulated districts in New York City, and second, by dividing certain Asian American communities of common interest. I should state that AALDEF has had a long history of working on voting rights. We have filed objections before the Justice Department under Section 5 in prior elections, and we, also, represented the Asian American defendant intervenors in Diaz versus Silver, and I have the citation in my testimony. The Task Force has already received out study. The Supreme Court has held that districts must encompass communities of interest. So, we commissioned Dr. Tarry Humm of Queens College to look at where Asian American neighborhoods and interests and concerns are, and we had community residents define their own neighborhoods. We had over 450 Asian Americans from Queens, Brooklyn and Manhattan participate in the study. We've, also, documented Asian American voting patterns by conducting non-partisan multilingual exit polls of Asian American voters, and last November we surveyed 2,300 Asian American voters in at least 15 Asian languages, and 13 polling sites across the City. My testimony this afternoon is based on our community survey project, our exit polls, review of Census data, personal knowledge of the Asian American community in New York and work with community based organizations and leaders. Census and the Census undercount. We have had, sine 1998, an extensive outreach project that included litigation, legal advocacy and community education on Census 2000. According to the United States Census Bureau, the under count of Asian Americans was about 1%. For non-Hispanic whites, that number is only 0.67%. The United States Census Monitoring Board estimated that in New York State, about 200,000 New Yorkers were missed in the Census. In New York City, that number was 150,000. Residents of New York City were more than twice as likely to be missed in the Census than in the entire state. Thus, we have urged that the Task Force should exercise its latitude under the Constitution, which allows for some de minimis variation of district population and place smaller districts in New York City, where most of the under count occurred. The City of Baltimore had employed a similar strategy. We actually applaud the State Assembly plan for their attempt to try to correct for the under count of racial and ethnic minorities in the Census. However, we are dismayed that the Senate plan goes the other direction, and it exacerbates the under representation of racial and ethnic minorities in New York City as a whole. We believe that the Senate plan has a disparate impact on racial and ethnic minorities. All of the State Senate districts with large Asian American, African American and Latino populations are overpopulated, conversely all of the districts with very small Asian populations, mostly in upstate New York, are underpopulated. Under the Voting Rights Act, redistricting must not have the effect of diluting minority voting strength. We believe that the Assembly plan, in regards to district population size, meets the standard, and has gone further to ensure representation of racial and ethnic minorities. However, the Senate plan has the effect of diminishing the representation of people of color. Furthermore, the orchestration of population deviations, we believe, implies an intent to dilute minority representation, while the Assembly plan in its principle in its proposal to place smaller districts in New York City, and the Senate plan dilutes racial and minority representation. Our plan or our proposals are here, and you can see how some of our communities are divided. We do appreciate and commend the districts in Flushing, and we endorse the redistricting proposals by the Latino Voting Rights Committee in Elmhurst, Richmond Hill, and Sunset Park. So, we urge the Task Force to look at those proposals. Finally, there must be a public process, and we've seen many deficiencies about the Task Force. We sent a letter to the Task Force on July 3rd, asking for any notices or information about hearings. We were never given official notice from the Task Force about these hearings, nor about when the plans would be made available. There are other defects in the process. We were never informed that the Senate would be proposing a 62-member Senate, and that's a problem. We do need -- the public needs to be able to provide meaningful input. We do look forward to working with the Task Force, probably, at the pre-clearing stage and afterwards on the redistricting plan. Thank you. MR. HEDGES: Glenn, I know you put out a public statement after the district lines were proposed. I don't believe that we ever actually got that directly from you, and I wondered if you could provide that for us? MR. MAGPANTAY: I'm sorry? MR. HEDGES: My understanding is that you, in fact, put out a press commentary at one point on the proposed lines, and I never actually received that, and I wonder if you could send it to me. MR. MAGPANTAY: Oh, certainly. We did a very preliminary analysis on the impact of the districts. We had seen what was done in Flushing, which was very good. We had seen some places where the community was divided. It's very small, and it's all here in our testimony. MR. HEDGES: Okay; great. MR. MAGPANTAY: But, I certainly will supply that to you. MR. HEDGES: If it's in the testimony, that's fine. Thanks. SENATOR SKELOS: Thank you. SENATOR DOLLINGER: Can I just ask one question? SENATOR SKELOS: Yes. SENATOR DOLLINGER: Is it the intention of the Asian American Legal Defense Fund to intervene in the pre-clearance process on both the Senate and the Assembly lines if these plans are forwarded unaltered to the Justice Department? MR. MAGPANTAY: We are seeking to participate in the pre-clearance process. We have already had discussions with the Justice Department, and we will be providing comments at the pre-clearing state. Regarding interventions, regarding the two lawsuits in Federal and State Court, we have not yet made a final decision, but we are exploring the possibility of joining those lawsuits representing the interests of racial, ethnic, and language minorities in New York City. SENATOR DOLLINGER: Thank you. SENATOR SKELOS: Thank you very much. Councilman Comrie. (No response.) SENATOR SKELOS: Phil Konigsberg. (No response.) SENATOR DOLLINGER: Can I just ask one other question before that gentleman leaves? Has that plan that he holds in his hand been submitted to the Task Force; is that your plan? MR. MAGPANTAY: Not entirely. This plan identifies the areas where there are Asian American communities of interest in our study, and that's this large report, heavy report, that you got in the mail. What we've done is we put the Assembly -- for each of the boroughs -- and it's in my testimony, -- each of the boroughs, and what the impact is, in terms of dividing Asian American communities of interest. So, we've done one for the Assembly, and for the Senate, for Brooklyn, Manhattan, and Queens, and they're the attachments to my testimony. SENATOR DOLLINGER: Have you submitted them to the Task Force? MR. MAGPANTAY: Yes. SENATOR DOLLINGER: That's all I wanted to make sure of. MR. MAGPANTAY: We have submitted them. MS. LEVINE: Did you submit them in computer form to us, or you just submitted it in the report? Because we got something from the Asian American -- I could be wrong, but it wasn't a plan, it was a profile. MR. MAGPANTAY: That's correct. MS. LEVINE: Okay, there's a big difference. MR. MAGPANTAY: That's correct. We would actually say that this is not -- the districts that we have here, we have not said are districting plans. What we have are communities where there are Asian Americans with common interests,that must be preserved in redistricting. We can provide these to you -- actually, they're drawn at the tract level, but we can provide them to you at the block level, and see what the impact is. I guess, the question is, that we receive the data at the VTD level, and we were looking, originally, to provide you data at the VTD level. When we had received the block assignments for the plan that had come out, we were told by the technicians, that they are only available at the block level. MS. LEVINE: The plans that the Task Force released, whether Senate or Assembly, were released to the public at the tract block assignment level, which allows you or your technical staff to aggregate that data to reflect the present configuration of those districts. I don't believe that we've received anything from your agency in a similar format, wherein we can take your submission, put it on a computer, and allow our members to properly analyze your submission, which hasn't really been made. I would suggest to you, Glenn, that if you're going to approach the Justice Department, that you provide us with that information so that we can equally examine your proposal fairly, also. MR. MAGPANTAY: Ms. Levine, we have made it available to the Task Force. You have a drawn district in our report that was made available. It was drawn at the block level, and you, also, have on paper, the attachments here, the tract assignment list for each of those districts. So, I know that you have received it. You may not have received it electronically -- MS. LEVINE: Well, obviously -- MR. MAGPANTAY: -- but, you have received it. MS. LEVINE: Okay, obviously, you have the ability to give it to us electronically, and I -- MR. MAGPANTAY: We do have the -- MS. LEVINE: -- would request -- MR. MAGPANTAY: -- ability to do that. MS. LEVINE: -- please, graciously, if you would submit it to us in that format, so that we can put that system -- put your plan on the system for each of the respective conferences to review that, which -- MR. MAGPANTAY: We'll be happy to. MS. LEVINE: -- will make it more clear for them, than looking at the map in your booklet. MR. MAGPANTAY: That's fine. MS. LEVINE: Thank you. SENATOR SKELOS: James Wu; is James here. MR. WU: I'm here on behalf of the Asian American Democratic Association of Queens. Also, Ethel Chen, Democratic District Leader, and Julia Harrison, Democratic District Leader. Gentlemen, I would like to congratulate you on the drafting of the proposed Assembly District plan, and conversely criticize you for the unfair drafting of the proposed State Senate District plan. On the proposed 22nd Assembly District, of which I am a long time resident, it seems to be one of the most compact and contiguous districts, most demonstrative of how districts should really look, and reflects the true spirit that should guide the drawing of legislative district lines. It seems you drew a proposed district to encompass a real neighborhood, or in the vernacular of redistricting, a community of interest. The neighborhood, Flushing, includes a large senior citizen population, and a large minority community population. Each group has its own range of distinct issues, and also shares common issues. But, where the most definite sense of community exists for all, is as a neighborhood of apartment dwellers, relying on common community facilities and commercial services. However, it appears you focused more on the minority community of interest, rather than the all encompassing community of interest that binds seniors, minorities and non-minorities. The reality of the neighborhood is that Flushing is a densely populated community, frequently defined as the third largest transportation hub in New York, but foremost as a neighborhood, and it is a neighborhood of apartment dwellers. According to the New York City Department of City Planning's Zoning Handbook, quote, "R-1 and R-2 allow only detached single family residences in certain community facilities, while in contrast, R-3-2 through R-10 accept all types of dwelling units and community facilities. Flushing is a neighborhood of apartments. Walking along Bowne Street, where I live, it is distinctly different from walking along Bayside Avenue. These are different neighborhoods. Crossing from an R- 6 to an R-2 zone feels like one is entering a different neighborhood, because one really is. There is a distinct difference between R-1, R-2 zones, versus other zones. R-3-2 through R-10 zoning districts seem to be the best definition of a community of interest for Flushing, defined by real lines drawn by the New York City Department of City Planning. If modifications to the 22nd A.D. are needed, I suggest following a non-partisan guide to district lines. The New York City Department of Planning is, perhaps, the best neutral guide to the real shape of communities of interest. Of course, if a serious objective of LATFOR is to develop a legislative district for a community of interest, that is largely minority, and shares the commonality of being multilingual and immigrant, trimming R-2 zones from the district, while it may shave city blocks that are proportionately higher percentage minority, will have a nominal impact on real numbers and strengthen the real community embodied by the proposed 22nd A.D. One of the attached maps is of the proposed 22 A.D. map to zoning maps. I've included a couple of these, and this is basically a consolidation of detailed maps from the New York City Department of Planning, which shows the 22nd A.D. and, also, some slight modifications to comply with the zoning line. I would suggest possible modifications to be encompassing to the south of the R3-2 zones of Mt. Hebron Cemetery slash Cedar Grove, as to do otherwise would potentially orphan the residents of those blocks from their immediate neighborhood. To the north, either mod 1, complying with the natural zoning boundaries, or mod 2, following the street boundary of Bayside Avenue. Also, to the east I would suggest, in mod 1, adjusting district lines in accordance with natural zoning boundaries, excluding the R2 zones, and encompassing more the R4 zones to compensate for population. On the State Senate plan, you have blatantly violated your duty in the spirit of redistricting, and I am most fearful of your contribution for reapportionment. You have been deliberately partisan, engineering the smallest populations for the slowest growing and mostly Republican districts, while making urban, mostly Democratic districts, disproportionately populous. This is statistical chicanery that does not comply with the spirit of the law. The 10% maximum deviation was intended for redistricting flexibility, not for all downstate districts to be 10% larger than upstate districts, so that you might conveniently violate the spirit of the Fourteenth Amendment. These are the maps that are included in here. One is just with the 22nd A.D., and one has some modifications in it. This is in all the handouts. I, also, included the details from the New York City Department of Planning, their individual sheets. I, unfortunately, did not have enough time to tape them all together as I did in this one, and then draw the lines on top of it. But, the little one, sort of, has this. Thank you. SENATOR SKELOS: Any questions? ASSEMBLYMEMBER PARMENT: Will you leave us a copy of that map, please? MR. WU: I can leave you a copy of the big one. ASSEMBLYMEMBER PARMENT: Either or both. MR. WU: Well, the little ones you have in the copies I left. ASSEMBLYMEMBER PARMENT: Okay. MR. WU: But, I'll give you a big one. It's a little sloppy. Thank you. SENATOR SKELOS: Bernice Cutler. (No response.) SENATOR SKELOS: Aida Gonzalez-Jarrin. MS. GONZALEZ-JARRIN: Thank you, Senator Skelos, Assemblyman Parment, and members of the Task Force. My name is Aida Gonzalez-Jarrin. I am a public administrator by profession, a former candidate to the City Council, and Vice President of La Gran Alianza de Queens. First, I wish to thank the Task Force for all the work that has been invested in preparing the new maps for the reconfiguration of districts, according to the 2000 Census figures. This, no doubt, is an awesome task. I also, wish to thank the Task Force for holding this public hearing, which allows community leaders and anyone interested in redistricting to have an input, a very important step in keeping our political system open to all, and hence, democratic. As a proud American citizen of Latin American background, I am also grateful to the Task Force for having translated the impressive growth of our community in Queens in an additional Assembly District now identified as District number 39. Hopefully, this new district will allow us to elect, for the first time, a representative with strong roots in the community, one who comes from our own immigrant experience, and yet is someone sensitive to the needs and diversity of the entire district, and above all, one who is not sent to us by extraneous or indolent political forces, but someone genuine, who we can support because of his or her proven track record of service to our community. Of course, we understand that we ourselves, the Latinos who live in this part of Queens must do the work. However, I am pleased to emphatically state that after our last year's first foray into the political arena of the Councilmanic race, our leadership has become stronger, better defined, more experienced, and is determined to act. I have seen the map produced by the Task Force, and I have to say, it's not bad. However, the map produced by the Voting Rights Committee of the Puerto Rican Legal Defense and Education Fund, with input of community leaders and participants is, in my opinion, a much better choice. Not only is it more cohesive in a geographical sense, but also, in terms of commonalities of interests, needs and social characteristics of the population involved. The residents in the district proposed by the Puerto Rican Legal Defense and Education Fund face more or less similar situations regarding the housing crisis, crowded schools, lack of health insurance, insufficient public health services, total lack of youth centers, and in the case of working mothers, an awful lack of child care, and other situations as they have been previously described by other individuals giving testimony this afternoon, including those who spoke in Spanish, and it's very unfortunate that no translator was available for some of them. Yes, you can rightfully argue, that these problems extend beyond the district. But, those of us who know the streets and corners and people of this slice of Queens, can attest, perhaps out of daily empiric observation, that these problems are more severe in this area concentrated in Corona, which has been clearly encapsulated in the Puerto Rican Legal Defense and Education Fund map, which I have included in my ten copies of my own testimony. For this reason, I am requesting the Task Force to give serious consideration to this alternative map, and I am grateful to the outstanding political and technical experts from PRLDEF, as well as the community representatives who participated in preparing this map. However, whatever is the final result, I want everybody to be aware, that our community is growing and coming of age. It is, therefore, to be expected that we will continue to organize and participate in the struggle to attain political power, and that if in the not so distant future, this will happen in every district where we have a substantial presence, be it 34, 35, 39 or a new Senatorial District, we know that only then all those issues that we feel have not been addressed in the past, or are not being addressed now, will be finally paid attention to. Last but not least, my reminder to all, that under the new and striking and reality of our diversity, which is the characteristic of our borough, our diversity in population, and which is a totally different reality from that of the early '60s, it is imperative to have Queens covered under the Federal Voting Rights Act. It's imperative, it's badly needed, and it's only fair. Thank you very much. I'll take any questions. SENATOR SKELOS: Are there any questions? (No response.) SENATOR SKELOS: Thank you very much. MS. GONZALEZ-JARRIN: Thank you. SENATOR SKELOS: Ruben, Q-u-i-r-o-z; are you here? (No response.) SENATOR SKELOS: Sheldon Leffler? (No response.) SENATOR SKELOS: Lorinda Chen. MS. CHEN: Hi, good afternoon. Mr. Chairman, distinguished panel, ladies and gentlemen. My name is Lorinda Chen. I am the President of the New York Chinese American Association, a 501-c-3 not-for- profit organization, dedicated to assisting and empowering Chinese Americans in their process of assimilation through advocacy, service and education. Our organization understands the importance of the redistricting process, and how it effects profoundly the Asian American communities in political representation, not only for the next ten years, but also for decades to come. The redrawing of political boundaries for all the districts every ten years, is crucial to limited English proficiency minorities, who are struggling to voice their concerns to the city, state and federal levels of government. Asian Americans are composed of various ethnic groups, but they share common interests, identical barriers, and dreams of being part of this society. They may look forward to electing officials who are fair, sensitive, open minded, waiting to listen to their concerns, and speak for their rights. And above all, represent their communities and common interests. According to the 2000 Census, Asian Americans are one of the fastest growing minorities in the United States. New York City is home to the largest Asian American population in the U.S.A. They are counted at 872,000 in the 2000 Census, and comprise 10% of the New York City population. About one half of the City's Asian population lives in Queens, and they make up 20% of the Queens population. Neighborhoods with large Asian populations in New York City, include Chinatown, the Lower East Side of Manhattan, Flushing, Elmhurst, Jackson Heights, Woodside, Jamaica, Richmond Hill, Ozone Park, Floral Park, Queens Village, Sunset Park, Borough Park and Bensonhurst, et cetera. Though New York City has the largest Asian population for all municipalities in the United States, for hundreds of years, not a single Asian has ever been elected to the New York State Legislature or Congress. John Liu, the first Asian American City Councilmember has recently been elected. New York Chinese American Association is advocating for districts that will provide Asian Americans with full and fair opportunities to elect candidates of their choice, and keep Asian communities with common interests and socio-economic characteristics together. The State proposed State Assembly District 22 in Flushing is a new an open district with 52% Asian Americans. We welcome it, but we're also concerned that the area residents between 35th Avenue and Whitestone Expressway, sharing common interests with that of the Flushing community in general, are not in this district. The north boundary of the proposed 22nd A.D. includes many nice and single large houses in North Flushing, quite a difference from the Flushing community in socio-economic characteristics. We propose to modify the boundary and make Bayside Avenue the north boundary of the 22nd A.D., and to include a section of 35th Avenue, and Whitestone Expressway, east of College Point Boulevard in the 22nd A.D. Although the proposed 22nd A.D. is good, other neighborhoods are divided in Queens. Residents of Elmhurst, Jackson Heights areas share common concerns and common interests. They are divided into three proposed districts. That's A.D. 34, A.D. 35 and A.D. 39. In A.D. 39, Broadway serves as a boundary on the southwest, dividing residents into different A.D.s. The residents on two sides of Broadway share common interests and similarities. They shop in the area's ethnic grocery stores. They dine at the ethnic restaurants. They seek health care at Elmhurst Hospital and they ride the subway, number 7, E, F, G, R. The Broadway section between Queens Boulevard and Roosevelt Avenue has a lot of Chinese business, and is called the third Chinatown, only next to Chinatown of Manhattan and Flushing. Both sides of Broadway have substantial numbers of Asian and Hispanic populations that share common interests and concerns, and should keep them together in one A.D. The proposed Senate Districts in New York City with large Asian American populations are overpopulated, while districts with very small Asian populations, mostly in upstate, are under populated. Flushing community has a large Asian population and has become the second Chinatown in New York City. It, also, has a large number of Koreans and South Asians. Together, they share a lot of similarities in education, speaking style, family values, and political representation. Nevertheless, Flushing is split between two proposed Senate Districts, S.D. 11 and S.D. 16. Richmond Hill, Ozone Park neighborhood, where many Indo-Caribbeans and South Asians reside, is divided among three districts, S.D. 10, S.D. 14, and S.D. 15. In conclusion, because of the language barriers, cultural differences, and familiarity with the system, Asian Americans may be less outspoken than their counterpart Americans, but they, too, want to be included in the decision making process. Asians in Flushing, Richmond Hill, Elmhurst, Sunset Park, Chinatown and many neighborhoods need representatives who are responsive to the needs and concerns of the immigrant communities, who understand and share American dream, that is being able to participate in all aspects of the life with dignity, fairness and equality. We urge the Task Force to keep Asian and ethnic communities together among the newly drawn political boundaries, and to ensure them a fair opportunity to elect candidates of their choice. Thank you. SENATOR SKELOS: Thank you very much. Questions? (No response.) SENATOR SKELOS: Frances Scanlon. MS. SCANLON: Good afternoon, Ms. Levine, and gentlemen. I just would immediately, as an attorney, reflect one correction on your good record, please. I am speaker number 15. I am an attorney, however, I am a former member of Community Board No. 7. Thank you. Let me wish you all a belated Purim, and a Happy St. Patrick's Day, since we are in the green sweater season, my blue notwithstanding. We are where we live. That is nowhere more true, than in the political calculation which determines what Councilmanic, what Assembly, what Senate, what Congressional District of which a citizen will be a part and entitled to vote therein. Talk about fine line drawings. No illustrator, no matter how formidable his or her talent, could ever calculate the compass in political terms that measures precisely within which political entity a citizen will become both a voter and/or a political player. He/she who draws the lines dictates the results. No Supreme Court decision, no matter how perceived to be outcome predetermined will arguably ever upstage the inherent power of the political line drawer. Ironically, it's that very elected official, in whom the public has placed such trust, that the public trust will do the right thing, both by the voter, and the official him or herself. And just what is the right thing? It's a matter of no mean calculation. Historically, civil rights have been liberated and realized in this country over the legal right to draw the line on those who would draw it incorrectly, as much as to determine whose rights would be vindicated, by drawing a district's line one way over another. Although born in Manhattan, I have resided in Queens for several decades and am a proud voter in the 20th Councilmanic District, 25th Assembly District, 16th Senatorial District, and 5th Congressional District, and what a chunk of political reality that is. There are more people from more countries speaking more languages, and more dialects within that social legal economic and religious territory, than perhaps any other that may be the subject of redistricting this year. What happens therein will shape the destiny of many political fortunes and misfortunes. This redistricting is more than academic. It's downright political, and that's the right thing. The public trust is elevated every single time an elected official does the right thing, even when there is very little at stake, and that's clearly not the present political reality. When one examines the legislative history and intent of statutes, state, federal, et cetera, which address redistricting and reapportionment, one is placed on unequivocal notice about the sanctity of what's in play. Draw the lines with a view towards the petty and the personal, and you will realize a disaffected, increasingly non-voting public therein. Draw the lines with a view toward the principle power of politics, and you'll shape an engaged and enthused voting public therein. Women in this country have only been voting for 82 years. In the big picture, that's not even an historic eye drop. But, in politics, that's decades of coming along, coming ahead, coming up. In the same spirit, political line drawing facilitates the ability of men and women, particularly those who have recently arrived, to ultimately come of age politically speaking. This ought be neither a mean or a small matter. What this Task Force hears, listens to and recommends, can upstage every front and back room deal. It can advance the ultimate political needs and interests of every citizen, voting and non-voting alike, within this democracy. It can truly predict the future political landscape and, perhaps, nowhere more compellingly than in this great borough, the borough of Queens. SENATOR SKELOS: Please summarize. We're trying to keep it to five minutes. MS. SCANLON: Certainly. You know I'm an attorney, every word matters. SENATOR SKELOS: But, we have a lot of people who still wish to testify. MS. SCANLON: And they will, and I'm sure you'll be patient with them, as you are with me, and I thank you. I do not suggest what you do or how you do it, rather that you initially reconsider what those before you did right and did wrong. Some of you have benefitted from either or both, but every elected official has been elected within some borders, some space, some geographical terrain, that was made legally cognizable due to this political process, over which you are now the gatekeeper. Don't leave politics out of the equation of your judgments. That's the beauty of the process. Leave no room, however, for the petty unprincipled, and personal. That's a set of factors that has never stimulated a win-win result, and that's truly where the best reapportionment is focused, how to achieve the most representative mix of people and politics within a given place. I thank you very much. SENATOR SKELOS: Thank you. Norman Silverman. MR. SILVERMAN: All right, the lines are now out, the proposed district lines for the New York State Assembly and Senate have been released to the public. The politicians, if they're part of the right crowd, have known about them for weeks. Why should ordinary citizens be concerned about ordinary district lines? Let's take a look at the Far Rockaway section of the proposed 23rd Assembly District. The 23rd A.D. covers the Rockaway Peninsula from the Nassau County line to the tip of Breezy Point. It, also, includes Broad Channel, which is an island in Jamaica Bay, Howard Beach, which is on the other side of Jamaica Bay, and some of Ozone Park. What the 23rd A.D. does not include is the center of Far Rockaway. The subway stations, the Community Board office, all of the shopping areas, and the blocks of densely populated apartment houses are part of another district, the proposed 31st A.D. The center of Far Rockaway has been joined with communities on the other side of Jamaica Bay, and John F. Kennedy Airport. The majority of the voters in this district are residents of Rosedale, Springfield Gardens, and South Ozone Park. They and the representatives they are likely to elect, do not ride the A train, which people in Far Rockaway use, attend Far Rockaway schools, or try to shop in the neighborhood. Political clubs in New York City are based on Assembly District lines. Instead of bringing far Rockaway residents together to solve common problems, the structure of political clubs in Far Rockaway serves to separate people who need to work together. The population in each district is identical, 123,854 or 123,855, but the ethnicity of the residents is not. In round numbers the three largest groups of residents over 18 in the 23rd A.D. are: white 63%, Black 10%, Hispanic 18%. In the 31st .A.D. the largest groups are: white 10%, Black 57%, and Hispanic 18%. There are those who may say that the creation of geographically tortured districts is necessary to increase the representation of historically under represented groups. The elimination of districts, which deny the rights of minorities to have a reasonable chance to elect representatives of their choice was a high priority in the 1960s through the 1980s. The priority today, is create districts where all residents can work together to solve their mutual problems. Minority representation can be increased through the use of multi-member districts and proportional representation. The public hearings are now going on. There are likely to be protests against the way the Democrats, who control the State Assembly and the Republicans who control the State Senate have proposed districts that are likely to keep them in power in the coming decade. It would be good if all of us look at the issues of legislative representation and prepare to find the solution that represents all of the people of the district, all of the people together, all of the people who share common way of life can be represented in a single district. We have a situation where our State Senate districts were changed so that the two incumbents, who represent part of the Rockaway and Broad Channel area are now residents outside of the districts that they might be expected to represent. Some of this seems to be a petty harassment of these people, who will be forced to move to continue to represent their districts, and I think this is beneath the level of the legislative process, and anyone who deliberately engaged in that, should be ashamed of that behavior. Also, thousands more people were put into downstate State Senate districts, than in the upstate districts. One of the first things they taught us when I went to college was learning the one man, one vote decision, and I will hope that the Supreme Court, if it gets that far, will look at this carefully and see that each person does get one person, one vote, as we should all aim for throughout the United States. Thank you very much. SENATOR SKELOS: Thank you. Lew Simon. Welcome. MR. SIMON: Good evening. My name is Lew Simon. I'm a Democratic District Leader. I represent the Rockaways west of Beach 95th Street, one side of Broad Channel, I want to be specific, the west side, a couple of E.D.s in Rockaway Park, one E.D. in Lindenwood, Ozone Park, and Woodhaven, which I understand we're losing now. The purpose of me being here now is to ask why; why are we split up? During many years that I've grown up and spent my life in the Rockaway peninsula, I've made many friends and neighbors. I'm often called upon because I'm the only name they recognize, and they know if they need something, they call upon me. Yet, I don't represent them all, and I question this. Why is a peninsula, 11 miles long, which we have the highest concentration, 28% of unemployment, largest number of nursing homes and mental facilities, the City has just dumped on us, the State has dumped on us for years, why we are split? I love my constituents, that we call the mainland. I love them in Howard Beach, Ozone and Woodhaven. I hate to lose them, but reality. I am one of the people who led a march to get rid of the Cross Bay Bridge tool for the residents. It's unfair if my constituents, that they want to see me, because I have one office, I can't afford two, that they have to come into Rockaway and pay a toll. I am trying to put Rockaway back on the map. As you know, flight 587 and also what happened on September 11th, we were devastated the most. We lost 95 people in our community that were killed on September 11th. One being my campaign treasurer, who left a wife and a five-year old. The plane that hit in Belle Harbor, we've been devastated. I tried, I brought a bus here, we were about 15 of us. We couldn't get people. Their hearts are not into this yet. They asked, why it wasn't in our community? I said, well, as usual we have to travel into Queens, into the mainland. But, what I'm asking is for two things. One, since the death of Pauline Cummings, who we loved dearly, in the 31st. there is now an opportunity to put Rockaway back together. I'd like Rockaway and Broad Channel and Breezy to be one. That's very important. The second thing I want to talk about, our Senator, Malcolm Smith. Malcolm has been a great friend. I have supported Malcolm through the years, even when he ran for City Council in the other end, which was not my end. Malcolm has done the right thing in the Rockaways. To give us Ada Smith, God help you for serving with her, I just have a problem. She can be real obnoxious, she's personally threatened me, and I want this on testimony, that she told me how dare I go into her Black community and tell her people what to do. I'm sorry, I'm very blunt. We were fighting the light rail, which we didn't want, and we were supporting the reactivation of the old Rockaway Line of the railroad as a regular MTA train, that we can have 35 minutes into Penn Station, not two and a half hours. You'd be surprised, if we had to drive here, with what's going on, on the Van Wyck, an hour and a half now. I think you can recognize, because you're from the Five Towns, but Malcolm has been our friend. We've been working together to bring the railroad back. We're working on a ferry. We're working to make a difference. We need Malcolm and say, hey, Malcolm, you live in the 14th, and now Ada just, I understand, moved into the 10th. Please, keep her. Bring her to Long Island, do what you want, but not in my area. Some people in Broad Channel, I will tell you, I also represent Broad Channel, they're not happy. She doesn't share her funds with everybody. And we're very much disillusioned with her, and I'll tell you, if she runs, I'll have to give her a primary, I'm going to be very up front. I, also, want to speak on the -- I know this has nothing to do with it, but I want to talk about the Council lines. The same thing goes with the Council lines. Rockaway, Broad Channel and Breezy should be the same. I just ran for the City Council in the 32nd. I lost by 200 votes, which is a very small amount. September 11th did play a part, unfortunately. And I just want to say that, as Rockaway is, we are a small island, and I'll tell you the truth, at one time before you represented the Five Towns, Carol Berman thought she was coming into Rockaway. She started to make meetings. We had no problem working with the Five Towns, okay. We want a contiguous line. We want to work together. We don't want to be divided. Right now, I'll be quite honest with you, at 7:30 at night, I wind up with five to six meetings, and anyone who -- you can ask anyone about me. I make all my meetings. How do I jump from Rockaway to Broad Channel, to Howard Beach to Ozone and Woodhaven, back to Rockaway, somehow I do it. But, I'm asking you, please, consider this. This is important. We want Malcolm. Malcolm has worked with us. I think you've gotten along with Malcolm. If I'm correct, Malcolm got the Republican line the last time, because we worked through everybody to make sure of this. So, please, hear us. I'm here if you -- anybody have any questions? (No response.) MR. SIMON: I thank you very, very much, and I'll be here. Yes, sir. SENATOR DOLLINGER: Just one, Mr. Simon. MR. SIMON: Sure. SENATOR DOLLINGER: I know both Senator Malcolm Smith, and Senator Ada Smith, and I always feel uncomfortable when one of my colleagues is criticized in a forum like this, and isn't here to represent herself and to defend herself. So, I would just strongly suggest that if you have such a difference of opinion about Senator Ada Smith's advocacy, you take that to her, and talk to her. MR. SIMON: We did. SENATOR DOLLINGER: Well, I'm going to encourage you to do it again, because I don't -- I'm uncomfortable in this forum listening to someone criticize one of my colleagues, who, because I come from Rochester and am not familiar with the Queens community that you're describing, I just think that that's inappropriate in this forum, and I would urge you to go talk to her about those complaints, and give her a chance, as she can, as she well can, to represent both her own interests, and in this case, defend herself. MR. SIMON: Well -- SENATOR DOLLINGER: I encourage you to do that. MR. SIMON: If I just might say to you, I'm very glad you represent Rochester, but if you come into my district, and you talk to the people that she represents, they're not very happy with her. SENATOR DOLLINGER: Well, I leave that up to her, but I would just strongly suggest, rather than this forum being a place to criticize a member for their representation, this is really about the communities of interest, and their nature. MR. SIMON: And that's what we're discussing. SENATOR DOLLINGER: Which I appreciate. I think your comments with respect to how far down the Rockaways that Senate District should come are very appropriate. But, I would just -- I would caution you against that kind of comment against Senator Ada Smith and simply say, with those complaints, take them to her, so -- MR. SIMON: We have. SENATOR DOLLINGER: -- she can defend herself. MR. SIMON: Thank you. Anybody else? (No response.) MR. SIMON: Thank you very much. SENATOR SKELOS: Norma Jimenez. MS. JIMENEZ: Yes, good evening. My name is Normal Jimenez, and I was born in the Dominican Republic and immigrated to New York as a youngster. I have lived in Jackson Heights over 25 years. I'm a member of the Community Board No. 3. I'm, also, Chair of the Youth Committee, a member of the Neighborhood Advisory Committee, and the Spanish Program Coordinator for Our Lady of Fatima. In addition, I am a Vice President of La Gran Alianza for Queens, a civic political club. My testimony today will e in Spanish because 25% of the borough's population speaks Spanish at home, yet we are not properly represented in government, and that's what I'm here for today. During the year 2000, I have participated in the activities of the Census as an organizer, and that gave me an opportunity to better understand my community. This is how I came to realize how many Latins we have residing in our community. And I was able to measure the importance of staying present and involve ourselves in the democratic process of this country. For this reason, I am here today, to protest the distribution of the legislative district maps proposed by the state. The lines drawn by the legislators in Albany divide our community at its very center, which is Corona, robbing our people of their opportunity to obtain other political positions. Hispanics make up 25% of the total borough population, and we deserve better representation at the local level, the Assembly, and in the state, et cetera. Our community opposes the approval of the proposed districts and demands that the plan proposed by the Latin Committee for Voters Rights in the New York metropolitan area be given consideration. This committee is a consortium of community leaders and activists, who have collaborated to design a map that draws a new Assembly District in northern Queens, that really represents the needs of our community. I thank you very much. SENATOR SKELOS: Thank you. Thank you for your patience. Carmen Aponte. (No response.) SENATOR SKELOS: Earl Williams. (No response.) SENATOR SKELOS: Fred Fu. (No response.) SENATOR SKELOS: Sister Janice Williams. (No response.) SENATOR SKELOS: Deacon Jimmy Stillwell. (No response.) SENATOR SKELOS: James Heyliger, H-e-y-l- i-g-e-r. (No response.) SENATOR SKELOS: Ludy Herrera. MS. HERRERA: Thank you for the opportunity to represent or talk about why I'm here today. Good afternoon to one and all. My name is Ludy Lugo Herrera. I am a bilingual school social worker, a mother of two children, and I have been a community activist for many years. I am a member of Community Board No. 3, along with Norma Jimenez, who just had her discussion. I am, also, a member of La Gran Alianza de Queens, a political organization founded by my husband, Genaro Herrera, and Fernando Fernandez, two great community activists. I live in Jackson Heights, currently Assembly District 34, and Councilmanic District 21. I am here to support the map drawn by the Latino Voting Rights Project and advocate on behalf of my community. According to the 2000 Census, our community has had the greatest population growth in any Community Board in the City, Community Board No. 3. Therefore, I firmly believe that this should enable us to have some say in how our map is redrawn. As a community activist and social worker, I am privy to the social ills effecting our community. I am very much aware of the lack of resources in our community, as I continuously refer clients to non-profit organizations and mental health facilities that are bursting at the seams with unending waiting lists of people awaiting for much needed services. There is an under representation of Latino elected officials in the County of Queens, and although Latinos make up 25% of the population, only one Latino has been elected to office at the City Council level, and none at the legislative or federal level. Those of us in the community are willing to argue that undoubtedly Latinos are willing to back any candidate that speaks to our issues and concerns, and does not ignore our needs. This is why now, more than ever, Latinos will not be divided in our communities which stand together to ensure that proper lines don't hinder our community's growth and prosperity in the next ten years. For far too long we have been ignored in Queens, especially in Corona, and this cannot continue to happen any more. Nevertheless, as a recent Hispanic Federation report on Latino political participation in New York City indicates, this lack of responsiveness from the political establishment has not stopped Latinos from mobilizing in Queens, as you have very well seen here toady. This report states that of the net growth of 253,028 Latino registrants between 1990 and 2001, 28% took place in Queens alone, adding 68,689 new Latino registered voters. And for those of you who are interested in these statistics, I would urge you to get in contact with the Puerto Rican Legal Defense Fund, and they will be very glad to provide you with a copy. In creating a new district, and redrawing the surrounding districts to respect the neighborhood realities of Corona, Elmhurst and Jackson Heights, it would be more empowering to go with the maps drawn by the Puerto Rican Legal Defense Fund and Latino Voting Rights Project. I believe that the current map drawn by the legislative bodies is splitting our neighborhoods and diluting our voice and our vote. The proposed districts 39 and 34 do exactly that, and although both districts have Latino majority populations, neither district captures the neighborhood histories and changes that have taken place. I want to share with you the fact that I came to this country in 1961, started out living in Corona. I am presently living in Jackson Heights, but have deep roots in Corona, and throughout the years as Community Board member, and community activist, I have seen how Corona has been over and over bypassed and ignored and neglected in regards to very much needed services. I would, also, like to say that we have a library and a school that have been throughout the years, totally ignored, and that's the Corona Library, and that's P.S. 19, where I went to in 1961 when I came to this country, and which Reilly, the Education Secretary, had the privilege to attend with Crowley. So, to your board members, I know my time is up, I'd like to say thank you for allowing me to participate in this redistricting, and I hope that you will consider our map, because it is a cohesive map and will, also, allow the distribution of services and funds to a much needed community that has many community interests in mind. Thank you. ASSEMBLYMEMBER PARMENT: Petra Perez. (No response.) ASSEMBLYMEMBER PARMENT: Petra Perez. (No response.) ASSEMBLYMEMBER PARMENT: Seymour Schwartz. (No response.) ASSEMBLYMEMBER PARMENT: Leonard Cutler. MR. CUTLER: Good evening. It seems as though there are lots of problems in Queens, New York, all the different districts, and I hear a lot more than little ones, and I'm only talking about the Rockaways. Now, I realize that I think that the law that was passed was very just, and it's for a good reason, minority reasons, and I think it all is very good. Everybody has a point to what they say. It will be a slow process, very slow, take a long time, I think, until all the different queries, all the representatives that wish to represent different types of people, different races and different religions will take a long time. But, there are a few mistakes, I think, that were pretty glaring that happened. One of them that glares right out is the Rockaways. My name is Leonard Cutler, and I live in the Rockaways. I've been here many years. I got married, and never left. For the last ten years we have had two representatives. Rockaway has been split up and each section tied in with a mainland district. This makes each representative not only responsible for his portion of the Rockaway peninsula, but to a larger portion on the mainland. It doesn't work. Rockaway must have one representative responsible for Rockaway only. You can't tie us to other areas that have completely different needs. The Rockaway peninsula has special problems, as it has the Atlantic Ocean on one side and Jamaica Bay on the other. Problems like transportation and unemployment are major issues that the mainland does not normally have, and New York City and the job market are easily accessible to them. Anyone can see where the elected official will put his weight as his reelection depends on the majority of his district's population, which is the main land. Look at the Rockaway peninsula. Look how it was cut up. This looks like tentacles of an octopus running in every direction. This, of course, is Councilmanic. Neighbors vote for different representatives, even though they live on the same block. A close examination of the redistricting map will show the narrow band of connection used to tie the Rockaways to the mainland. It is not only ridiculous, but the way it was done is unconstitutional, and it was proven so. We have been terribly gerrymandered. One Rockaway peninsula representative, concentrating on Rockaway's problems will go a long ways toward helping people live on a beautiful peninsula. Presently, we are having a building boom. Every empty piece of land is spoken for. Supposedly, two-family homes are selling like hot cakes with little money down. The carrot dangled is that the rental apartment will defray the cost to the homeowner. It all looks good on paper, but let the economy falter, like it is at the present time, and watch the foreclosure rate go up like a rocket. We need business and people with disposable income to build up the Rockaways, not people barely holding their own. One representative will be able to focus on the whole picture of what all the Rockaways need, and wants to survive and flourish, rather than separate representatives dealing with small pockets on the peninsula where their districts may stretch into. Mr. Lew Simon is a very good man, a very energetic man, and he does go over and above normal duty. He works in districts that he doesn't even belong to. Please, put us back together again, with one common voice. In unity, there is strength. I gave you all the reasons why, you heard from everybody, and you don't need any more from me. Thank you. ASSEMBLYMEMBER PARMENT: Thank you. SENATOR DOLLINGER: Just one question. ASSEMBLYMEMBER PARMENT: One question, Mr. Cutler. SENATOR DOLLINGER: Mr. Cutler, come back just for a second. How many people live in the Rockaways, do you know, the whole think put it all together, the east and the west? MR. SIMON: According to the Census, 110,000 people. SENATOR DOLLINGER: 110,000? MR. SIMON: 110,000; with Broad Channel, it would bring us to about -- THE REPORTER: You have to come up to the mic. MR. SIMON: According to the Census, with Broad Channel, we're about 125,000. The Rockaways, from one end to the other, between 110,000 and 120,000. And there are enough votes there, if they put us back together, that we would be able to take in an Assembly District, and be part of a -- take in a part of a Council District, almost all of it, as well as a Senate District, and it can work. SENATOR DOLLINGER: The only reason why I asked is because the Senate Districts have to have about 305,000. MR. SIMON: Right. SENATOR DOLLINGER: Somewhere between 305,000 and 315,000 people. MR. SIMON: Right. SENATOR DOLLINGER: The point I'm making is this. Even if the Rockaways were combined in a single district, because of the population requirements, it would be no more than a third of a total Senate District. MR. CUTLER: We were always tied with Broad Channel, which has the same problems. MR. SIMON: The Senate District right now, as it stands, is all of Rockaway. SENATOR DOLLINGER: Correct, that's my understanding. MR. SIMON: Right, and it will stay that way, but we are trying to keep our Senator. But, the Assembly, it is split up. You have blocks there, which he's talking about, one block is in the 31st, one block is in the 23rd, and if the peninsula, which is an 11- mile island, which we -- I would love for you to come walk with me, I'd be glad to take you out and show you. SENATOR DOLLINGER: Malcolm Smith has made the same invitation. MR. SIMON: Okay. SENATOR DOLLINGER: I'm understand. MR. SIMON: I'm serious. If I have to come to Westchester and pick you up, I'll do it. SENATOR DOLLINGER: No, Rochester. MR. SIMON: Sorry. SENATOR DOLLINGER: That's a long way to go. MR. SIMON: You know what I'll do, I'll pay for your flight in, back and forth, and we'll take you out there, and we'll show you. SENATOR DOLLINGER: I can't do that. I promised never to take gifts, so I can't do that. MR. SIMON: Well, we are -- SENATOR DOLLINGER: But, at some point we'll get down here. MR. SIMON: I just want to say, we are a good group. Now, Senator Skelos is the next district, in the Five Towns. He knows us. We've spoken with the planes and everything, we share the same problems. All we're asking is, keep us together. Don't break us up. I mean, honestly and truly, by breaking us up, all you do is -- like he told you, I go and I help everyone. You're not letting me gain anything. I love helping people. I don't make any money as a District Leader, okay. But, you're not helping me to -- this man lives in Bayswater. He doesn't -- he can't vote for me, okay. He'd like to go and vote for me. He can't, okay. I'm cut off at the Cross Bay Bridge, okay, I don't want to be cut off that way. I grew up in Arverne. I've spent my whole life in the Rockaways. Don't cut me out. That's what we're asking. SENATOR DOLLINGER: I'm not suggesting that that's not a legitimate concern. My only concern was to explain that the -- even if we put the whole Rockaways as it currently is, it's only a third of a Senate District. I won't speak for the Assembly District plan, but just to drive home that point. The Rockaways has to have a partner in a Senate District, and it will only be, at most, a third. I understand that that's what you want. MR. SIMON: Right. SENATOR DOLLINGER: I'm just suggesting that -- MR. SIMON: Well, we want to keep Malcolm. We want to keep -- what would work for us is, keep the Senate line the way it is, it's perfect. It's there, he's a minority representation, it works, we have no problem. Then, what we ask you to do with the Assembly line, put us back to the way we were. Back before you broke us up in '92, we were Rockaway, Broad Channel, and Breezy Point, and we even went into a part of Rosedale and Howard Beach. We'll take that. We'll take that. SENATOR DOLLINGER: Okay. MR. SIMON: Thank you. SENATOR DOLLINGER: Thank you. ASSEMBLYMEMBER PARMENT: Mary Finlay. VOICE: I have a statement from her. ASSEMBLYMEMBER PARMENT: You could just submit it. Just leave it with the desk. We'd be happy to receive it. ASSEMBLYMEMBER PARMENT: Ed Finlay. VOICE: Same thing. ASSEMBLYMEMBER PARMENT: We'd be happy to receive their statement. The record would reflect their statements. VOICE: I have statements from people who wanted to be here from all parts of the Rockaways. ASSEMBLYMEMBER PARMENT: Okay, we'd be happy to receive them, and they will be placed in the record, and given the same weight as oral testimony. VOICE: Thank you. ASSEMBLYMEMBER PARMENT: Shoshana Bleiberg. (No response.) ASSEMBLYMEMBER PARMENT: Florence Fleschner. (No response.) ASSEMBLYMEMBER PARMENT: Julia Phillips. (No response.) ASSEMBLYMEMBER PARMENT: Frances Harrison. (No response.) ASSEMBLYMEMBER PARMENT: Helen Barnett (No response.) ASSEMBLYMEMBER PARMENT: Emmanuel Fox. (No response.) ASSEMBLYMEMBER PARMENT: Marcia Fox. (No response.) ASSEMBLYMEMBER PARMENT: Fran Goldstein. (No response.) ASSEMBLYMEMBER PARMENT: H. Cutler. (No response.) ASSEMBLYMEMBER PARMENT: Carl Gruning. (No response.) ASSEMBLYMEMBER PARMENT: Mary Gruning. (No response.) ASSEMBLYMEMBER PARMENT: Charlotte Buchman. (No response.) ASSEMBLYMEMBER PARMENT: Robert Hoft. (No response.) ASSEMBLYMEMBER PARMENT: Robert Menshe. (No response.) ASSEMBLYMEMBER PARMENT: Marcia Gluck. (No response.) ASSEMBLYMEMBER PARMENT: Harvey Gluck (No response.) ASSEMBLYMEMBER PARMENT: Louise Lane. (No response.) ASSEMBLYMEMBER PARMENT: Charlene Lane. (No response.) ASSEMBLYMEMBER PARMENT: Ruth Goros. (No response.) ASSEMBLYMEMBER PARMENT: Sol Goros. (No response.) ASSEMBLYMEMBER PARMENT: Michael Titus. (No response.) ASSEMBLYMEMBER PARMENT: Michele Titus. (No response.) ASSEMBLYMEMBER PARMENT: Chris Sartori. (No response.) ASSEMBLYMEMBER PARMENT: Richard Berger. MR. BERGER: I address the Co-Chairs and the members of this panel. I thank you for hearing me out. My name is Richard Berger, and I am a lifelong resident of the Belle Harbor community of the Rockaway peninsula. Now, it's my understanding that in order to -- back ten years ago, in order to get certain candidates in, they did the gerrymandering to move the lines around to reflect the races of the population. Okay, no problem with me. I ended up with an African American gentleman, who did a very good job until he stepped down. I have no problem with that. But, what I have a problem with is the fact that the lines that we are now proposing are going to split what should be one community into multiple communities again. I'm actually hoping on getting the lines moved back to where they were in 1992. It is, again, making the entire Rockaway peninsula, which as most of you might know is an 11-mile long stretch by one mile wide piece of basically reinforced sand bar, and the Broad Channel community. If we get Howard Beach in it, okay. We're all areas that are very close to the water, and areas that, if that force four hurricane comes in, we'll have to be evacuated. But, the thing is, we are ending up, with the way that the lines currently are, and the proposed moving of the lines, is going to divide the community. I find it somewhat ridiculous that the community of Broad Channel, fine upstanding citizens that they are, I have many friend there, especially in the Broad Channel Fire Department, that they have one representative if they live on the east side of the main street running through the community, and they have other representation if they live in the west side of the same street. Admittedly, politicians, even in the same party, will be in disagreement with each other, but I think that it should be more the case that they should be united in their representation, because they're all the same community, whether they live on the east side or the west side of Cross Bay Boulevard in the Broad Channel community, or they live on the east side or the west side of Beach 94th Street on the peninsula, or however the line may zigzag this time. Once again, I thank you for hearing me out. I am kind of winging it at this time, but any questions that I might be able to answer. SENATOR SKELOS: How can I get one of those buttons? MR. BERGER: Well, this is left over from Malcolm Smith's last election. As I should mention, I'm also a member of the Good Government Regular Democratic Club, which is Lew Simon's clubhouse. SENATOR SKELOS: If I can get one of those buttons, not that it would influence me. (Laughter.) MR. BERGER: No idea. This is the only one I collected. SENATOR DOLLINGER: Senator Skelos, he's our Malcolm, just so we lay claim to him. MR. BERGER: Thank you. SENATOR SKELOS: I can return that to you at some point. Thank you very much. MR. BERGER: I thank you for your time. SENATOR SKELOS: Bernice Cutler. MS. CUTLER: You know, I really didn't want to come here, because I pulled a tendon, but I like Rockaway too much. My name is Bernice Cutler. I was born and raised in the Rockaways, and I've got sand in my shoes, and I've been here all my life. I have seen Rockaway with one representative for the entire peninsula, and I've seen it with two representatives in the past ten years, and I can honestly say that, in this case, more is definitely less. There has rarely been unity between the two representatives over the past ten years, with regard to Rockaway. In fact, greater divisiveness has been perpetuated due to it. While many might say that the peninsula's problems began prior to the 1990 redistricting, having two representatives only made it more difficult to address Rockaway's many problems. Residents have the double task of going to approach both representatives on many issues to try to get things done, and even after doing so, we often find that one representative doesn't want to step on the toes of the other. Therefore, problems on our peninsula stay unaddressed or stalemated. Redistricting Rockaway so weirdly configurated, that people only blocks away from each other, with the same problems, do not have the ear of the same representative. To make matters worse, neither part of the Rockaways has any clout in the peninsula's well being and survival. Each part has been tagged on to separate parts of the mainland, which make up the more powerful constituency for each district. And just like a businessman, who wants to stay in business, the two representatives must cater to the mainlanders, because that's where the bulk of their votes come from. Only by uniting Rockaway into one district, with one representative will our voices get heard, as that one representative will have to work for us alone to keep his or her job. We Rockawayites are a lot wiser these days, and we want a more proactive say in what goes on here, without the veto power of mainlanders. For example, we in Rockaway needed reactivation of the Long Island Rail Road to help economic development, a 38-minute ride to New York City, rather than a long, erratic, and sometimes dangerous A subway line we now have. Mainlanders did not want their quality of life effected by the upheaval of the reactivated line, and guess who won? Certainly not Rockaway. According to the redistricting chart of ten years ago, A, districts shall not be drawn for the purpose of separating geographic concentrations of voters enrolled in the same political party in two or more districts, in order to diminish the effective representation of such voters. Well, most of Rockaway are Democrats, and our clout as voters has been severely diminished. B, district lines shall keep intact neighborhoods and communities with established lines of common interest and association, whether historical, racial, economic, ethnic, religious or other. The Rockaways, like Broad Channel, which successfully fought redistricting ten years ago, is a contiguous body of land, geographically isolated, surrounded by water, whose residents certainly share common interests and problems. In fact, with a total population more than 100,000 when combined with Broad Channel, a community of similar interests, we have enough voters to be one full district. The Rockaways is not the Balkans, and all neighbors and neighborhoods of the Rockaway peninsula need to speak with one loud voice, through one common representative. I would like to read a letter written by the Past President of the Rockaway Civic Association, and member of Community Board 14, if I may. Do I have time? MS. LEVINE: You have about a minute and a half. MS. CUTLER: I'll make it quick. Petition to make the Rockaway Peninsula a single unit in future redistricting. Redistricting, at present, appears to be based on two major principles. One, the party in power in the State Legislature arranges districts to promote the election of party incumbents. Two, districts are arranged on racial or ethnic grounds to favor Black, Hispanic, Orthodox, et cetera, candidates. This results in a weirdly shaped district, with long skinny fingers, stretching in all directions. For example, Congressman Weiner, whose major area is in Brooklyn, has the south western part of the Rockaways, with a long narrow finger along the waterfront, directly opposite Congressman Meeks' office, to include an orthodox area along the Nassau border, which has named itself West Lawrence. Some have said that Weiner was unaware that he represented the narrow finger along the water, and that the residents of the narrow finger thought that Congressman Meeks, whose office was across the street from where they lived, was their Congressman. This type of redistricting presumes that Blacks cannot or will not ever vote for a white candidate as a better representative, and that whites would never choose a Black candidate. It tends to perpetuate racial, ethnic and religious divisions in the population. Rockaway is a fairly narrow, isolated peninsula with many common interests among its residents, including transportation, aircraft noise, proximity to the Atlantic Ocean on one side, and Jamaica Bay on the other, with many common waterfront planning problems. The population is over 100,000, very close to a full district. It would be just about a district size if Broad Channel, which has a precise similarity of interests were included. Actually, this is the precise configuration of the Community Board District 14, Queens, which is based on geographical, contiguity, and where residents of all colors, religious and ethnic origins are able to function in harmony. Thank you so very much. May I tell you something, I -- I'm a Hungarian, and I bake good strudel, and I make good Hungarian goulash. This, I'm not good at, and I thank you very much. SENATOR SKELOS: Thank you, you did great. MS. LEVINE: You should have brought us some goulash, then. (Laughter.) SENATOR SKELOS: Let's see, Sara Berger. MS. BERGER: I've been upstaged by my own son. I have a prepared speech, but I'm going to change it a little bit. I think the statistics that we were given on the population are out of date and changing rapidly. My oldest son lives in a major city in North Dakota, which has at present -- the whole city -- has less population than what we just gave you for Rockaway. But, Rockaway is being built up. Everywhere you turn, there are new houses. There are people moving in. As fast as they are finished, they're sold, and they are occupied, and they're generally two and three-family houses being occupied. You can't find a place to rent. I grew up in Rockaway. I live in the west end of Rockaway, but I went to school in the east end. I still live in the same house. My daughter went to school in the west end. When she married, she moved into the east end, and her son went to school up here, up in the west end. It just worked out that way. How could we do that? Because we are one community. We've always been a diverse community, and we are getting more and more so, but we all have the same problems. We have the transportation problems, which have already been discussed. We've had problems with airplanes, which have made headlines. I don't have to go through that. We have more long term care facilities than any other part of the city. We have more public housing than any other part of the city. We need to keep a representative that represents all of us. As has been mentioned, we are more of a white population than anything else, but we elected a Black Senator twice. We had Senator Walden, and we elected Senator Smith, so that doesn't become a question. If we get someone good, we're going to vote for him. You may notice that those of us who came together on the bus are all white -- VOICE: I'm not. (Laughter.) MS. BERGER: Except for two, that's what I was going to say. I haven't forgotten you. SENATOR SKELOS: He, also, had the Republican line, too, I think. MS. BERGER: Yes. That wasn't my business. (Laughter.) MS. BERGER: I forgot, we also have all these SROs. Our problems are different from the problems of say, Forest Hills. We're not a summer community any more, but we get a large number of people in t he summer, day trippers. It presents a completely different problem for policing the area. So, we've got transportation problems, we're at the end of the line. When we ask for better transportation, they say, oh, we can't do it, the line that goes down there is the longest line, that's why you get such poor service. I don't get the logic, but that's what they keep telling us. I work with Senator Smith in a different category. I've been a part of his Veteran's Advisory Committee. I'm a World War II veteran. I've seen him in operation, and I've seen how he works for the area. He was tied to the area, in many ways, before he ever became our representative. He knows our problems. I'd like to keep someone there who continues to work for us. Sure, we have to share the representative with another area. That will happen no matter what. SENATOR SKELOS: Go on finish up, that's okay. MS. BERGER: I'm used to using a timer myself. I run a meeting At any rate, we know we have to share any representative, but if we're divided into a smaller and smaller portion, we become a smaller and smaller tail on a larger dog somewhere else. Thank you. SENATOR SKELOS: Thank you very much. Rochelle Guinness. MS. GUINNESS: It's Guinness, like the beer. (Laughter.) MS. GUINNESS: Good evening everybody. My name is Rochelle Guinness. I live in the Nesponsit section of Rockaway, and I work in the Far Rockaway area, as a mental health professional. I'm here tonight to appeal to you about our being able to keep Malcolm Smith. I speak on it for a couple of reasons. Because of the community interest that he has shown, not only with what we've been through in the last few months, which has been monumental, we are certainly on the map, and everyone knows where Rockaway Beach is now. But, Mr. Smith has been ongoingly aware of what's going on with the development. Development of the old urban renewal area, that's been vacant for years, since I was a tiny child, and I'm now 49. I work in the Far Rockaway area, and I work with a very diverse indigent population. Malcolm Smith is aware of those issues. He has worked very hard with us to maintain our hospital in Far Rockaway, that was in a Chapter 11, to be on board with the community and not close. We are a highly underserved area in health care. I don't want to -- I want to again mirror what Sara said. I live in the west end, I work as a health care professional in the east end. We have two little hospitals. I know that Malcolm has been on board with us with all of those issues, with getting development, not only with houses, but with schools, with businesses, because we're going to have a shortage of stores with the amount of homes that are being built. Malcolm has been on top of this. I think that with what we've been through, we need continuity and not fragmentation, and so I'm appealing to you as a board to please consider that we be able to keep him in our 10th Senatorial District. Thank you. SENATOR SKELOS: You would like to see the continuity and the continuation -- MS. GUINNESS: Of his being able to represent us. SENATOR SKELOS: Okay, thank you. Eva Farrell. MS. FARRELL: Good evening. I'm Eva Farrell. I'm from Rockaway Point. I'm a resident of Rockaway Point, and I'm basically here to support the continuation of Malcolm Smith as our Senator. You really need to keep somebody in our community, who is in touch with our needs, aware of what the needs of Rockaway are, and willing to work with us in improving the problems that we have out in Rockaway. Malcolm Smith has come to our Good Government Democratic Club on a number of occasions. I've spoken to him personally, people in the club have. He's aware of our problems with transportation into the Rockaways. He's aware that ordinary residents who live there don't want to travel and hour and a half to two hours, both ways, to go to work. As a mother of two young children, he is aware that there is a great deal of overcrowding in our schools, and he is also aware that as time goes ont, that's, also going to become more problematic, because there's a lot of building in Rockaway, a lot of housing being built, a lot of people having children. There's many people I know who are having children now, who are afraid they won't even be able to get their children into the schools that are in our community. I feel that if the Senator was to change at this point, you're starting from ground zero again, trying to get somebody on board to be, at least, aware of the issues, and to start working on them. People have to decide whether they're going to stay in the Rockaways or whether they're going to leave, and issues like it taking two hours to get to work, and not knowing if you can put your children in the local school are issues you're going to consider in whether you're going to stay in that community or not. I have to say that Malcolm Smith has personally assured us that he will take these considerations we've brought to him seriously. He will take them seriously, he will try to work on them with us. He shares our interest in these issues. That's very important, because in the past, we don't feel we had that kind of representation on many issues. I don't know if it will be any different in the future. We understand he is not a miracle worker. He has constraints to work within, but at least he's willing to try, and he's willing to look at these issues, and to help the ordinary people of Rockaway who live there. So, I'm here tonight to just reiterate some of my colleagues point of view, that we want the lines to retain the same Senator from the 10th District that we have now. We feel he shares our commonality of interest, and we would like to keep Breezy Point, Broad Channel, and Rockaway together as one, because it does have a very divisive effect on the community for people who are living across the street from each other to have different representation, and for there to be certain political backlash if one representative is able to help one side of the community, and another representative helps another side of the community. We're a racially and religiously mixed peninsula as a whole, and we would like to have somebody who can represent all of us. We share the same libraries, we share the same Post Offices, we share the same schools, we share the same water, we share the same air traffic noise, and we have common problems. So, I would ask you to consider keeping those three communities together, in terms of your redistricting decisions, and to please consider keeping Malcolm Smith in his position as our representative. Thank you very much. SENATOR SKELOS: Let me assure you that representing Long Beach, I share the noise with you, and I certainly do understand that. But, you do feel its important to maintain the core and the continuity of the district for the people of the Rockaways and the neighborhoods? MS. GUINNESS: Yes, I do. I think for him to -- for the ball to be dropped now, would be to the entire communities detriment. He's at least aware of these issues. He's asked for our survey in terms of restoring transportation to the Rockaways. He wants to review that survey. He's not promising us anything, but he will review it. We'll have another survey done, possibly, if we have to. At least he is taking our complaints seriously, and I think to switch now to somebody else, who would have to start from square one would just set us back in time. SENATOR SKELOS: Thank you. MS. GUINNESS: Thank you very much. SENATOR SKELOS: Eric Strangeweiss. MR. STRANGEWEISS: I'm from Sheepshead Bay Brooklyn, and I'm here because, of course, the Brooklyn hearing was during the day. The fact that these hearings are not scheduled in the evening at a convenient time is part of the low priority that's given to this matter, not necessarily from your commission, but from the Legislature and, I guess, ultimately, the people of the state have given this a whole effort a low priority. That's, also, seen in the web site. For instance, if the web site has maps, which are black and white, not only not very easy on the eyes, but hard to read. If you look at the meeting transcripts, you click on that, you not only find there's no meeting transcripts available, you find, also, that you get, like X40 parentheses input error. So, there's some sort of technical error. Obviously, not much resources were put into that or any aspect of this. Turning to the substance of things, what I suppose energized me was the creation of a district in Sheepshead Bay. Before I mention that, I want to start with one quote that really struck me, and that was this. It was referring to the Councilmanic race, but -- the same redistricting, but the same principles apply to this. If they cooperate with us, we'll cooperate. If they're wiseguys about it, we'll redistrict them out to Weehawken. That comment was made by representative -- not representative, Councilmember Giamato, Republican of mostly Staten Island. He gets a piece of Brooklyn, too, the way the districts go. Now, you can't really blame him. It's defensive against what he perceives. He's in the minority, but getting back to Sheepshead Bay, we have this narrow corridor going down between Y and Z, Avenues Y and Z, a single block wide, to connect between Bensonhurst or Dyker Heights area and Bay Ridge, and over to Mill Basin. According to John Hamilton, the political columnist of the Bay News and other Courier Life Papers, this was created as a seat for Marty Golden, to have a large number of Irish Americans, and to not have as many Jews. Now, I don't know whether that's true or not. Maybe, it's in the meetings with the non-existent transcripts. Maybe, you haven't had meetings. So, welcome to get to know each other. According to the site, there's no meeting transcripts. But, whether or not it's true, the fact that this kind of specter of prejudice and bad feeling is even being raised is serious, and it illustrates the fact that there has to be a higher level of rationality and humaneness in this process of redistricting. The two-party system is existing at the sufferance of the American people. There is no representation of the Green Party, or the Working Families Party in the redistricting process. It's a throw back to just a two-party system, to bossism and things like that, and if it doesn't work, the American people, and the people of New York State will change it. Now, according to everything that I understand, the Assembly and the Senate, when they're controlled by opposite parties like this, have a gentleman's agreement. They each don't bother the other side if they let the dominant party in each house set the district lines, and they don't bother the others. This should not be, and you can imagine how polarized the staff must be. I can only appeal to the staff to try to maintain some principles in all of this. When a bill, a certain type of bill, the Speaker or the Majority leader of the Senate release their legislators, they could vote their conscience, this is the way the redistricting should be done. The staff working with the commission members, should be released from party obligations to come up with a rational and humane system of redistricting. I just want to say quickly, I do not go along with some of the people who want to keep communities insular. Of course, there are going to be district lines, and they may cross neighborhoods, but they should be rational. They shouldn't be odd shaped districts. Thank you. SENATOR SKELOS: Thank you, sir. That completes -- VOICE: She didn't sign in, but she wants to speak. SENATOR SKELOS: Sure. MS. HARRIS: Good evening, and thank you for allowing me to speak without a card. My name is Terry Harris. I'm the President of Bay Towers Tenant's Association, and I, too, come from the Rockaways, and I share the same interests as my former residents, partners, associates. We all live in the same area. We all have the same problems, as you already have heard. But, someone spoke about you live across the street from your neighbor, and someone else is representing you. That is so true. Bay Towers is consists of two buildings, a total of 375 apartments. When we vote, one have to go to one area of one building, and the other building has to go to somewhere else. Now, for the past five, ten years or so, many people thought one building thought they were represented by someone else, Malcolm Smith represented the other half, of Anthony Weiner represented one, and somebody else represented the other one. Now, what we are trying to do right now, as you heard from Lenny, is to keep everybody together. I am a member of St. John's Baptist Church, located on 74th Street. We were looking at some property around the area,74th Street and Rockaway Beach Boulevard. When I went to one Congressman, it wasn't his district. I had to go to someone else. When I went to this other person, they said, well, this is not my district, but I'll help you the best way I can. The thing is, if we had one person, then I, too, would remember that one person's name, and we could go to this one person for whatever information we need or whatever assistance we need. Right now, development is going on all around us at St. John's Baptist Church, and we still don't know if we will be able to get assistance from anyone, because of the different many people that are supposed to be in our area, that we don't even know who they are. So, I, too, join with my colleagues. If we had one person, and Senator Malcolm Smith has been there for us, both in the tenant's association, in the community and all around us, he has been there. And if we can truly keep him as our representative, we'd be more than happy to do so. Of course, we cannot do so without your help, so we are pleading to you this evening for your assistance, your help in allowing us to keep Malcolm Smith as our Senator. Thank you. Of course, before I leave, you can see I am one of the minority. (Laughter.) SENATOR SKELOS: Thank you. MS. LEVINE: That would be female; right? (Laughter.) SENATOR SKELOS: Is there anybody who would like to speak, who has not already had the opportunity. (No response.) SENATOR SKELOS: Seeing no hands, I move we adjourn. SENATOR DOLLINGER: Second. SENATOR SKELOS: All in favor? (Aye.) SENATOR SKELOS: Opposed? (No response.) SENATOR SKELOS: Thank you very much. (Whereupon, 7:10 p.m., the Hearing was concluded.) C E R T I F I C A T I O N I, FRANK X. GRAY, a Notary Public in and for the State of New York, do hereby state: THAT I attended at the time and place above-men- tioned and took stenographic record of the proceedings in the above-entitled matter; THAT the foregoing is a true and correct transcript of the same and the whole thereof, according to the best of my ability and belief. IN WITNESS WHEREOF, I have hereunto set my hand this 21st day of March, 2002. FRANK X. GRAY EN-DE REPORTING SERVICES, LTD. 212-962-2915 |